CSL versus EVO Data Logger Comparison

22-04-2009, 01:13 AM

Now this one is for the real geeks amongst us

A friend of mine has a 440bhp Evo (the doctor who was caught by the police on the MLR trip to the Isle of Man, from a previous thread). His best lap at Knockhill is 56.6 seconds, on BTCC slicks. My best data logged lap is 58.9 seconds, on Toyo 888s (and 245 all round as well LOL)

So we thought we'd do a compare against distance, not time, using the software so you can see comparable speeds, G forces etc at the same point on the track. Below is what I found (I'm in Red):

1. On our entry into Duffus, we both have identical cornering G forces (lateral acceleration), but my speed is slightly slower (71mph versus your 77mph)
2. Not sure what this means - if this is accelerate/brake g forces then it looks like I'm accelerating slightly longer than you through the Duffus dip - but I'm also 6mph less than you so I have some catching up to do LOL
3. Point 3 is in the duffus dip on the left hander. You have more G force here than me, but our speeds are now equal on the entry to this corner, before you then gain 10mph(!) more on the exit, before we both brake for Clarke.
4. My turn in to Clarke seems to produce slightly more G force, but I have slowed down more, my slowest point is again 10mph slower - you are 57mph I am 47mph.
5. Not quite sure what this is telling us - am I starting G forces earlier by turning in earlier than you possibly? The first turn in has equal G forces but the second you are slightly higher.
6. We seem to have similar braking G forces here, but I claim the win for having a teeny weeny bit more lateral negative G force LOL. Again presume I am turning slightly earlier than you which is why my graph starts going back to positive G earlier?
7. I'll give you this one, although it's amazing how the small indents in the graph are almost identical between the two cars!

8. We have identical speeds on the exit of the chicane.
9. I'm claiming this one, it looks like you started braking before me

10. Identical G forces on this corner
11. Again, identical speeds on the exit of the corner
12. I think this is a gearchange?
13. Is this the extra horsepower here, or the extra low down torque you have? Your car builds speed up that bit faster than mine, but its far more apparent when we get to the pit straight and its uphill where you need the torque!
14. I definitely claim the win here :-) Your top speed along railway before braking was 116mph, mine was 111mph, 5mph slower but I braked a lot later than you ;-)
15. I've got ever so slightly more positive G going round the hairpin, but they're similar curves. Your lowest speed point is earlier than mine, which is proving the slower in faster out approach I think. Your slowest speed is 39mph I'm 34mph, and you're already on the power a lot earlier than I am.
16. Wow! You're *miles* faster here - partly due to you getting on the power earlier out of the hairpin, but is your Evo monster got better torque than the CSL? I'm presuming torque is king here for the struggle uphill.

dave1 · 22-04-2009, 12:17 PM

440 bhp? is that what he has told you? try 520bhp

englebert · 22-04-2009, 10:23 PM

For the difference in speed between tuned Evos, check this out... (CSL 4th from bottom).

dave1 · 22-04-2009, 11:47 PM

straight lines dont mean squat

englebert · 23-04-2009, 11:28 AM

In a straight line they do

dave1 · 23-04-2009, 12:29 PM

good reply

shane@mbtech · 26-04-2009, 08:48 PM

Its this comparison that is making me think "keep my evo and dont get the csl"

Im stuck at the moment, my evo, currently 450bhp different turbo to 500bhp, or sell and get a csl, put ap's and kw clubsport on. ???? decisions decisions

I know its not all about the straights but evos are hardly slow round corners are they, the ex evo boys who have bought csl have mostly sold the csl's now as well,

2bar boost · 27-04-2009, 07:20 PM

I have still got my CSL and cant see me going back to Evo's just yet! They are a different machine altogether, im just enjoying not having the constant fear of breakages

Fancy a X FQ360 as its more practical for me at the moment but just cant give up the grin factor that the CSL gives..

Lifes not all about straight line acceleration

22-04-2009, 01:13 AM	#1
Steve Gill Guest Posts: n/a Casino cash: $	CSL versus EVO Data Logger Comparison Now this one is for the real geeks amongst us A friend of mine has a 440bhp Evo (the doctor who was caught by the police on the MLR trip to the Isle of Man, from a previous thread). His best lap at Knockhill is 56.6 seconds, on BTCC slicks. My best data logged lap is 58.9 seconds, on Toyo 888s (and 245 all round as well LOL) So we thought we'd do a compare against distance, not time, using the software so you can see comparable speeds, G forces etc at the same point on the track. Below is what I found (I'm in Red): 1. On our entry into Duffus, we both have identical cornering G forces (lateral acceleration), but my speed is slightly slower (71mph versus your 77mph) 2. Not sure what this means - if this is accelerate/brake g forces then it looks like I'm accelerating slightly longer than you through the Duffus dip - but I'm also 6mph less than you so I have some catching up to do LOL 3. Point 3 is in the duffus dip on the left hander. You have more G force here than me, but our speeds are now equal on the entry to this corner, before you then gain 10mph(!) more on the exit, before we both brake for Clarke. 4. My turn in to Clarke seems to produce slightly more G force, but I have slowed down more, my slowest point is again 10mph slower - you are 57mph I am 47mph. 5. Not quite sure what this is telling us - am I starting G forces earlier by turning in earlier than you possibly? The first turn in has equal G forces but the second you are slightly higher. 6. We seem to have similar braking G forces here, but I claim the win for having a teeny weeny bit more lateral negative G force LOL. Again presume I am turning slightly earlier than you which is why my graph starts going back to positive G earlier? 7. I'll give you this one, although it's amazing how the small indents in the graph are almost identical between the two cars! 8. We have identical speeds on the exit of the chicane. 9. I'm claiming this one, it looks like you started braking before me 10. Identical G forces on this corner 11. Again, identical speeds on the exit of the corner 12. I think this is a gearchange? 13. Is this the extra horsepower here, or the extra low down torque you have? Your car builds speed up that bit faster than mine, but its far more apparent when we get to the pit straight and its uphill where you need the torque! 14. I definitely claim the win here :-) Your top speed along railway before braking was 116mph, mine was 111mph, 5mph slower but I braked a lot later than you ;-) 15. I've got ever so slightly more positive G going round the hairpin, but they're similar curves. Your lowest speed point is earlier than mine, which is proving the slower in faster out approach I think. Your slowest speed is 39mph I'm 34mph, and you're already on the power a lot earlier than I am. 16. Wow! You're miles faster here - partly due to you getting on the power earlier out of the hairpin, but is your Evo monster got better torque than the CSL? I'm presuming torque is king here for the struggle uphill.

22-04-2009, 10:23 PM	#3
englebert S5 - Full Throttle Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Kent Posts: 397 Casino cash: $705	For the difference in speed between tuned Evos, check this out... (CSL 4th from bottom). __________________ '03 SG CSL - SOLD Making do with a CSL replica, 1M and E90 M3.

23-04-2009, 11:28 AM	#5
englebert S5 - Full Throttle Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Kent Posts: 397 Casino cash: $705	In a straight line they do __________________ '03 SG CSL - SOLD Making do with a CSL replica, 1M and E90 M3.

26-04-2009, 08:48 PM	#7
shane@mbtech CSL Register Uber-poster! Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: warrington Posts: 5,419 Casino cash: $19783	Its this comparison that is making me think "keep my evo and dont get the csl" Im stuck at the moment, my evo, currently 450bhp different turbo to 500bhp, or sell and get a csl, put ap's and kw clubsport on. ???? decisions decisions I know its not all about the straights but evos are hardly slow round corners are they, the ex evo boys who have bought csl have mostly sold the csl's now as well, Last edited by shane@mbtech; 26-04-2009 at 08:50 PM.

22-04-2009, 12:17 PM	#2
dave1 S5, Sport Off, DSC M-track Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: CORNWALL Posts: 937 Casino cash: $1432	440 bhp? is that what he has told you? try 520bhp

22-04-2009, 11:47 PM	#4
dave1 S5, Sport Off, DSC M-track Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: CORNWALL Posts: 937 Casino cash: $1432	straight lines dont mean squat

23-04-2009, 12:29 PM	#6
dave1 S5, Sport Off, DSC M-track Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: CORNWALL Posts: 937 Casino cash: $1432	good reply

27-04-2009, 07:20 PM	#8
2bar boost S4 - Getting the hang of it Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: South East Posts: 229 Casino cash: $793	I have still got my CSL and cant see me going back to Evo's just yet! They are a different machine altogether, im just enjoying not having the constant fear of breakages Fancy a X FQ360 as its more practical for me at the moment but just cant give up the grin factor that the CSL gives.. Lifes not all about straight line acceleration