S54 stroker kit - Page 3

_Nathan_ · 27-10-2010, 08:21 AM

Think there is something wrong with those figures too...

160mph = 257kmh
Veyron 0-250kmh time: 13.3

So either increasing compression make it really, really fast, or it is a 0-160kmh time (0-100mph) in which case it seems a bit slow?

nick///M3 · 27-10-2010, 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flow

My car has got 2 sets of trackwheels , AP's al around , half cage , SS stepped headers , SS mid section , SS race backbox , map , Billstein , recaro profi carbon bucket seat ,... .
So i'm looking fo the next step .

My car has got 70k miles , so for this winter i wanted to make sure the block is alright and change some parts ( oil pump , water pump , alternator ect.. ) check the headgasket , bottem end .
So why not rebuild the block with the stroker kit so i'm safe for a couple of more years .

The other option is to buy a 997 GT3 but i like my CSL too much , so instead of giving 80k € for a GT3 i invest some euro's in the egine so i can suprise some GT3 owners on the racetrack .

ouch! i did not have any idea that you are passed that point !!! my bad...

well if you are not really happy with what you got, and have the extra cash then buy a gt3...
don't try to push the S54 more n/a...

i haven't seen a stroker that actually made some good results and i am on several boards reading...

and i am all about n/a as you can see in my sig...
after spending lots and lots of time on this topic i am not going to try an persuade another person into doing it...

if you want more power from the S54 then charge it...simple as that...

But when you have a csl...

other than that options are vac, kelleners, kk-automobile but i really can't say its working or not....

best of luck
Nick

nick///M3 · 27-10-2010, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lawsy

I done that, but it lacked grunt out of slow speed corners, and straight line speed was not impressive, the rest of the package was great though.

you went with higher compression and cams and it was still low?

nick///M3 · 27-10-2010, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rutkowski

This past week i have been researching this subject thoroughly!!

The Kelleners S54 with stroker kit M3 makes some interesting numbers. 0 - 62mph in 4.2 seconds. 0 - 160mph in 10.8 seconds. The compression is 12.1

The crank that has been used is the OEM BMW one iirc.

I am really, really tempted as achieving a genuine 400bhp would be possible.

i think you have some numbers wrong here...

0-100km/h ( 62mph ) 4,2...seems too much but with decent tarmac can be done..
0-160km/h ( 98mph ) 10,8 that is the correct number....and kind of slow if you have 4,2 0-100km/h...

10,8 to 250km/h is certainly not for an n/a S54 engine car.......

no way this is happening....

_Nathan_ · 27-10-2010, 09:00 AM

I know of a couple of 3.4 strokers that make good numbers (420-430), but ultimately don't seem to be much, if any, more than proper 3.2s. Just seems 2 ways of going about the same job, higher RPM screamer or more grunty but lower revving?

**glendog74** · 27-10-2010, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nick///M3

ouch! i did not have any idea that you are passed that point !!! my bad...

well if you are not really happy with what you got, and have the extra cash then buy a gt3...
don't try to push the S54 more n/a...

i haven't seen a stroker that actually made some good results and i am on several boards reading...

and i am all about n/a as you can see in my sig...
after spending lots and lots of time on this topic i am not going to try an persuade another person into doing it...

if you want more power from the S54 then charge it...simple as that...

But when you have a csl...

other than that options are vac, kelleners, kk-automobile but i really can't say its working or not....

best of luck
Nick

Good advice

Thorney · 27-10-2010, 10:15 AM

Whilst there are a few stroked 3.2 cars racing generally the view is that the gains they offer are not significant on track to justify it. Power is gained but you drop torque which also makes the conversion less dramatic on a road car. Cams make a difference but if you want over 400bhp you need to run an aftermarket ecu and on a road car that creates its own issues.

The Gorilla · 27-10-2010, 10:55 AM

Hi,

The very paramiters of what a 'Racing Car'
needs to do should tell those interested that increasing
stroke on the S54 is taking the engine in the wrong direction.

While a stroked S54 might be nice on some unrestricted
Autobhan or Route 66 freeway, its not going to deliver
its promise on a Race Track.

For a Road car then maybe, but as a means to increase
power on a S54 Track / Race car, spend the money as
'Nick' has already suggested,on chassis dynamics, weight saving,
etc and see proper gains for your money.

Regards,

The Gorilla.

_Nathan_ · 27-10-2010, 11:00 AM

I'd have guessed that a 3.4 producing 420bhp might be a little less stressed than a 3.2 producing the same though? Less revs may well mean better reliability which could be seen as a good attribute in a race car.

I may be completely wrong though!

The Gorilla · 27-10-2010, 11:30 AM

Hi,

Nathan- As with any Race Car or Race series
its not down the straights where Races are
won and lost, its around the twisty bits.

Reliability aside, most would agree that the
best car in F1 at the moment is the Red Bull,
with a Renault engine.

Is this the fastest car down the straight or
through the speed trap, no, does the Renault
engine make the biggest amount of power no,
does the renault engine Rev, yes, will the
Renault engine over rev past 18,000 rpm
yes, is the Renault Engine power band
well matched to the gearbox ratios, yes.

So back to the S54, for Track or Race your
much better off with an engine that will
rev to 8500 / 8750, where the power band
and rev drop can be better matched to
gearbox ratios, which stroking the S54
does not do.

Stroking reduces revs, wrong direction, and also
moves the engine power band/ rev drop backwards
meaning your going to always be wanting to shift
down not up to keep the engine well on the cams.

If I was racing today, I would be using a S54 3.0LTR,
yes they do exist, but they are shorter stroke, longer
rod engines.

Shorter stroke Engine would rev much quicker,
and the longer rods would increase the engine torque.

That is why I said that 'Stroking' the S54 is taking it in the
wrong direction for Racing.

Regards,

The Gorilla.

27-10-2010, 08:21 AM	#21
_Nathan_ Driving it like I nicked it Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 2,099 Casino cash: $13060	Think there is something wrong with those figures too... 160mph = 257kmh Veyron 0-250kmh time: 13.3 So either increasing compression make it really, really fast, or it is a 0-160kmh time (0-100mph) in which case it seems a bit slow? __________________ Nathan

27-10-2010, 09:00 AM	#25
_Nathan_ Driving it like I nicked it Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 2,099 Casino cash: $13060	I know of a couple of 3.4 strokers that make good numbers (420-430), but ultimately don't seem to be much, if any, more than proper 3.2s. Just seems 2 ways of going about the same job, higher RPM screamer or more grunty but lower revving? __________________ Nathan

27-10-2010, 10:15 AM	#27
Thorney S5 - Full Throttle Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 469 Casino cash: $3876	Whilst there are a few stroked 3.2 cars racing generally the view is that the gains they offer are not significant on track to justify it. Power is gained but you drop torque which also makes the conversion less dramatic on a road car. Cams make a difference but if you want over 400bhp you need to run an aftermarket ecu and on a road car that creates its own issues. __________________ http://www.thorneymotorsport.co.uk

27-10-2010, 11:00 AM	#29
_Nathan_ Driving it like I nicked it Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 2,099 Casino cash: $13060	I'd have guessed that a 3.4 producing 420bhp might be a little less stressed than a 3.2 producing the same though? Less revs may well mean better reliability which could be seen as a good attribute in a race car. I may be completely wrong though! __________________ Nathan

27-10-2010, 10:55 AM	#28
The Gorilla S5, Sport Off, DSC M-track Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 740 Casino cash: $14401	Hi, The very paramiters of what a 'Racing Car' needs to do should tell those interested that increasing stroke on the S54 is taking the engine in the wrong direction. While a stroked S54 might be nice on some unrestricted Autobhan or Route 66 freeway, its not going to deliver its promise on a Race Track. For a Road car then maybe, but as a means to increase power on a S54 Track / Race car, spend the money as 'Nick' has already suggested,on chassis dynamics, weight saving, etc and see proper gains for your money. Regards, The Gorilla.

27-10-2010, 11:30 AM	#30
The Gorilla S5, Sport Off, DSC M-track Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 740 Casino cash: $14401	Hi, Nathan- As with any Race Car or Race series its not down the straights where Races are won and lost, its around the twisty bits. Reliability aside, most would agree that the best car in F1 at the moment is the Red Bull, with a Renault engine. Is this the fastest car down the straight or through the speed trap, no, does the Renault engine make the biggest amount of power no, does the renault engine Rev, yes, will the Renault engine over rev past 18,000 rpm yes, is the Renault Engine power band well matched to the gearbox ratios, yes. So back to the S54, for Track or Race your much better off with an engine that will rev to 8500 / 8750, where the power band and rev drop can be better matched to gearbox ratios, which stroking the S54 does not do. Stroking reduces revs, wrong direction, and also moves the engine power band/ rev drop backwards meaning your going to always be wanting to shift down not up to keep the engine well on the cams. If I was racing today, I would be using a S54 3.0LTR, yes they do exist, but they are shorter stroke, longer rod engines. Shorter stroke Engine would rev much quicker, and the longer rods would increase the engine torque. That is why I said that 'Stroking' the S54 is taking it in the wrong direction for Racing. Regards, The Gorilla.