So who has the most highly modified CSL?

[Mike R]

Originally Posted by The Gorilla

Hi,

Quote - ''I thought you were a Cecil expert ?

Firstly the claimed factory figure is 355bhp (360PS) and secondly, very few make that figure.....


I am no expert on CSL's, never claimed to be,
never said that the std car makes 360 BHP either,
simple search would qualify my own thoughts
on that.
I actually said a CSL with 360 BHP.

So maybe good to heed your own advice on assumptions ?

TB's with Throttle actuators give almost the
same response as Roller Barrels, so its more
bling than really zing.

The Cosworth engine only comes with a single throttle butterfly as standard, the roller barrel arrangement is from a works WRC car, it's not standard.

Originally Posted by The Gorilla

Your Turbo is heavily modified due to ''heat issues'',
[which was my point not assumption]
and replacing the Turbo Spindles with a larger
spindle made of better material has been
done for years.
Michelotto were doing in the late 80' early 90's.

Der, of course, it's a track car, so it's required. I didn't say it was cutting edge, I just clarified your assumption that all the parts wouldn't be up to scratch .

Originally Posted by The Gorilla

As regards air temps the reason for asking
for a different mean temp reading was to see
what degregration the engine suffers performace
wise, as large fans blowing nice cool air through
static Charge Cooling in not real world.

It suffers very little, as it has water injection as per the works cars, which activates at 44 deg C. This has two 0.6mm jets supplied by a 6.8 bar pump (to ensure that it can overcome the boost pressure, which inject a fine water mist into the inlet charge, which maintains the charge temps around this figure. However, as explained to you earlier, I have yet to have this come on since fitting the larger capacity intercooler. So the real world figures match the dyno . In fact in the vids, you can see the charge temps displayed on the read-out in the centre of the dash .

Originally Posted by The Gorilla

As regards the chassis its the mechanical grip that
keeps the ''patch'' in contact.

And the aero . The Escort is one of the first cars that had negative lift (downforce).

Originally Posted by The Gorilla

As I said fun Car, but not for me.

I will watch out for your super S54 though
with great interest.

Regards,

The Gorilla.

It is, but it's too focused - as you can hear in the videos, it's harsh and noisy - hence why I want something that is a little more of a compromise. The E90 is just too far the other way .

It does seem that there are too few gains to be had from the engine, so I may end up just being a sheep yet .

[Mike R]

If anyone is taking their Cecil to the Snetterton track day with Stu (Bealo) in June, I'd appreciate a couple of passenger laps and would be glad to reciprocate (if you can stomach my inferior driving ) .

[alexk]

Originally Posted by Mike Rainbird

It does seem that there are too few gains to be had from the engine, so I may end up just being a sheep yet .

I believe we all said this some pages ago, but after all we are just CSL owners for some years

[chicken]

Originally Posted by Mike Rainbird

And the aero . The Escort is one of the first cars that had negative lift (downforce).

Uhuh... But can it do this?

http://youtu.be/7ve5NBSayHI

[Mike R]

Originally Posted by alexk

I believe we all said this some pages ago, but after all we are just CSL owners for some years

Hence why I'm questioning real world owners . We don't appear to have heard from many modified peeps yet though .

[Pooky]

Originally Posted by Mike Rainbird

We don't appear to have heard from many modified peeps yet though .

Because there aren't any?

[Mike R]

Originally Posted by Neil M

There are lots on available on ebay:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-E46-M3...item4abead7632

Are there any internal differences between a CSL engine and a normal M3?

[alexk]

Originally Posted by Mike Rainbird

Hence why I'm questioning real world owners . We don't appear to have heard from many modified peeps yet though .

I don't mean to sound funny or something, but many of us explained why modifying the S54 is a costly and pointless process.
Now you are questioning why people with modifications don't write their experience... I am not sure what you haven't understood up to now ?

A mate from Greece did the whole shebang. I will ping him to write something if he wants.
He had to rebuild the engine a few times.

Edit : you are still unaware of the CSL vs. M3 engine differences. Maybe start with what the OEM engine has next time

[Mike R]

Originally Posted by alexk

I don't mean to sound funny or something, but many of us explained why modifying the S54 is a costly and pointless process.
Now you are questioning why people with modifications don't write their experience... I am not sure what you haven't understood up to now ?

A mate from Greece did the whole shebang. I will ping him to write something if he wants.
He had to rebuild the engine a few times.

Edit : you are still unaware of the CSL vs. M3 engine differences. Maybe start with what the OEM engine has next time

Well that is because there seems to be conflicting information out there. I'm not after another 100bhp, but as mentioned, as close to a real 400bhp as possible. This seems to be almost achievable with cams, full exhaust system and mapping (384bhp has been quoted earlier in this thread with these mods), so I assumed that making the full 400bhp could be achieved with this, combined with a slight increase in compression ratio and some porting of the head.

Same with the engine differences, it states that the internal differences are only the cams, but I have also read elsewhere of mention of the valves being bigger, but not seen confirmation of this.

[alexk]

Originally Posted by Mike Rainbird

Well that is because there seems to be conflicting information out there. I'm not after another 100bhp, but as mentioned, as close to a real 400bhp as possible. This seems to be almost achievable with cams, full exhaust system and mapping (384bhp has been quoted earlier in this thread with these mods), so I assumed that making the full 400bhp could be achieved with this, combined with a slight increase in compression ratio and some porting of the head.

Same with the engine differences, it states that the internal differences are only the cams, but I have also read elsewhere of mention of the valves being bigger, but not seen confirmation of this.

Some searching wouldn't be bad.

Here is the list of differences CSL list
The list was compiled mainly by Tom aka NZ_M3 and some other members.

The engine differences.
- Engine block (supposedly picked from the least flawed cast) – The blocks have the same part numbers as M3, Z4, but the full short block is a different part number 11007833675
- Engine head (exhaust valve and intake/exhaust cams - longer duration, same lift) – intake cam shaft 11317835041 exhaust cam shaft 11317835043 Exhaust Valve 11347833676 (30,5/5,95mm) – the valve springs are exactly the same
- Intake plenum (carbon airbox as we like to call it) Air Collector 11617833496 filter 13727838625 The other half of the carbon box: 11617833497 and control unit 11617833498 all the other ducting 11617833646; 11617833645; 11617833648; 13717896774 intake grill 51117895883
- Extractors/Headers (same as post 2005 M3s and Z4) 11627833500; 11627833643
- Cat converter (200 cell) 18307833673
- X pipe, resonators (thinner material - slightly lighter) 18107833503
- Rear muffler - slightly lighter 18107833504
- Different ECU - 25% more capacity 12147837328; 12147834982
- Pseudo Alpha N engine management (delete of MAF, but still runs a MAP sensor, and air temp sensor 13621739510- debate as to whether this is just for idle control however) MAP sensor part number 13627833561

Again, I don't understand why you believe that you will achieve 400bhp with cams, remap and full exhaust. Even with increased compression ratio.
This is daydreaming (the BMW Motorsport engine makes this figure).
Tuners obviously will tweak the dyno parameters to show big gains.
With cams, remap, full exhaust system, you are looking at 10ish bhp from stock.