View Full Version : Missing Air intake flap
mattCSLnut
02-11-2009, 09:02 PM
As per title, I notice a week ago that the large, plastic flap is missing from my intake :smt017 (as per pic below) where it is expected to be attached to the central rod. The car seem to run VERY WELL as it is but I just wanted to ask a couple of questions about it.
a) Is this some sort of a CSL modification for more power ?
b) Should I worry about any future problems as a result of NOT having this part ?
c) What does it actually do ?
Just wondering, that's all :whistle:
I thought that was the flap that opened when you pressed the sport button?
(sure someone with actual knowledge will answer this properly lol)
_Nathan_
02-11-2009, 09:24 PM
Loads have removed it.
First things first - does the bar move when the car hits about 3.5k rpm in sport mode? If so you can refit the flap, if not then it was remoeved as the actuator \ sensor is broken.
If it does and you need the flap drop me a pm as I've got one in the garage.
SpineOnABap
02-11-2009, 09:47 PM
It's ONLY there for noise supression, so no problems running without it.
shane@mbtech
02-11-2009, 09:54 PM
As per title, I notice a week ago that the large, plastic flap is missing from my intake :smt017 (as per pic below) where it is expected to be attached to the central rod. The car seem to run VERY WELL as it is but I just wanted to ask a couple of questions about it.
a) Is this some sort of a CSL modification for more power ?
b) Should I worry about any future problems as a result of NOT having this part ?
c) What does it actually do ?
Just wondering, that all :whistle:
hmmm seller did not disclose this info, what else is he not telling hmmm
One question did you check the car over with a whitestick before buying:whistle:
mattCSLnut
02-11-2009, 10:01 PM
Loads have removed it.
First things first - does the bar move when the car hits about 3.5k rpm in sport mode? If so you can refit the flap, if not then it was remoeved as the actuator \ sensor is broken.
If it does and you need the flap drop me a pm as I've got one in the garage.
I'll need to check that with some assistance :thumbs: Would the broken sensor show up on diagnostic ?
mattCSLnut
02-11-2009, 10:07 PM
hmmm seller did not disclose this info, what else is he not telling hmmm
One question did you check the car over with a whitestick before buying:whistle:
I trust Jeff didn't remove that part (I don't think) as he would have mentioned it to me. Everything else is SUPERB with my chosen CSL. It's absolutely FAN-Bloody-Tastick :thumbs: THANX for caring :whistle:
mattCSLnut
02-11-2009, 10:09 PM
It's ONLY there for noise supression, so no problems running without it.
That I have :hahaha: Lots of LORVELY INDUCTION noise :drool:
mattCSLnut
02-11-2009, 10:14 PM
It's ONLY there for noise supression, so no problems running without it.
Are U 100% sure ??? :smt017
mattCSLnut
02-11-2009, 10:18 PM
I thought that was the flap that opened when you pressed the sport button?
(sure someone with actual knowledge will answer this properly lol)
When I press my SPORTS button, difference can VERY much be felt, whilst on the move. It's as if someone has dabbed the loud pedal without me touching it. :thumbs:
shane@mbtech
02-11-2009, 10:19 PM
Are U 100% sure ??? :smt017
Yeh loads do it, its like having the sport button on permanently. It will cause no harm, its noise all the time for you. Some prefer it as you can have noise even without sport, some dont like the throttle twitchiness with sport on you see.
And i do care,:gayfight::gayfight::birdman:
I wasn't even aware it was missing Matt, sorry. I've not really examined the engine bay in that much detail in 3000 miles of ownership.
I have no idea who removed it and given that the engine noise increased as expected when the sport button is pressed I had no reason to suspect otherwise.
Lawsy, I have nothing to hide but maybe the previous owners did. Assuming I should know everything ever done to a car with 5+ owners is a bit stupid to be frank - quite a naive comment to make.
Jeff
shane@mbtech
02-11-2009, 10:21 PM
When I press my SPORTS button, difference can VERY much be felt, whilst on the move. It's as if someone has dabbed the loud pedal without me touching it. :thumbs:
And if you had a flap, which would be functioning correctly it opens with sport on to give the lovely induction noise, sport off= no induction noise.
The throttle inputs change and it becomes more sensitive.
shane@mbtech
02-11-2009, 10:24 PM
I wasn't even aware it was missing Matt, sorry. I've not really examined the engine bay in that much detail in 3000 miles of ownership.
I have no idea who removed it and given that the engine noise increased as expected when the sport button is pressed I had no reason to suspect otherwise.
Lawsy, I have nothing to hide but maybe the previous owners did. Assuming I should know everything ever done to a car with 5+ owners is a bit stupid to be frank - quite a naive comment to make.
Jeff
It was made in gest, calm down,
How would the engine noise increase if there was no flap to open??????
But tbh 2 people who did not know or even check this operation is amusing, naive even, possibly, stupid, maybe. Your words.
glendog74
02-11-2009, 10:26 PM
It also opens with sport 'off' - just at a higher rev bracket.
I removed my flap over a year ago and although i now don't get the night and day sound difference between sport on and off, i do still get a noticeable audible difference when sport is selected on. It may be due to my SS Race silencer, but the noises definitely hardens and gets raspier when sport is on :drool:
mattCSLnut
02-11-2009, 10:28 PM
I wasn't even aware it was missing Matt, sorry. I've not really examined the engine bay in that much detail in 3000 miles of ownership.
I have no idea who removed it and given that the engine noise increased as expected when the sport button is pressed I had no reason to suspect otherwise.
Lawsy, I have nothing to hide but maybe the previous owners did. Assuming I should know everything ever done to a car with 5+ owners is a bit stupid to be frank - quite a naive comment to make.
Jeff
No worries Jeff. As I said earlier, I totally TRUST U as you were/are VERY honest & open about you CSL and I'm REALLY, VERY happy with it :thumbs:, as it is. THANX again :thumbs:
And I do agree with U, it was a bit of a "LAWSY" comment but then I did turn his CSL down in favor of yours, so may be there is a bit of :gayfight: going on :whistle:
mattCSLnut
02-11-2009, 10:29 PM
And if you had a flap, which would be functioning correctly it opens with sport on to give the lovely induction noise, sport off= no induction noise.
The throttle inputs change and it becomes more sensitive.
I have LOVELY induction noise ALL of the time +1 :whistle:
shane@mbtech
02-11-2009, 10:30 PM
No worries Jeff. As I said earlier, I totally TRUST U as you were/are VERY honest & open about you CSL and I'm REALLY, VERY happy with it :thumbs:, as it is. THANX again :thumbs:
And I do agree with U, it was a bit of a "LAWSY" comment but then I did turn his CSL down in favor of yours, so may be there is a bit of :gayfight: going on :whistle:
Sorry, its you southerners with no sense of humour, :gayfight:
My car is most definitely not for sale, but if it was it would come complete with fully functioning air flap.:birdman::birdman:
glendog74
02-11-2009, 10:32 PM
As per title, I notice a week ago that the large, plastic flap is missing from my intake :smt017 (as per pic below) where it is expected to be attached to the central rod. The car seem to run VERY WELL as it is but I just wanted to ask a couple of questions about it.
a) Is this some sort of a CSL modification for more power ?
b) Should I worry about any future problems as a result of NOT having this part ?
c) What does it actually do ?
Just wondering, that's all :whistle:
I trust Jeff didn't remove that part (I don't think) as he would have mentioned it to me. Everything else is SUPERB with my chosen CSL. It's absolutely FAN-Bloody-Tastick :thumbs: THANX for caring :whistle:
That I have :hahaha: Lots of LORVELY INDUCTION noise :drool:
When I press my SPORTS button, difference can VERY much be felt, whilst on the move. It's as if someone has dabbed the loud pedal without me touching it. :thumbs:
No worries Jeff. As I said earlier, I totally TRUST U as you were/are VERY honest & open about you CSL and I'm REALLY, VERY happy with it :thumbs:, as it is. THANX again :thumbs:
And I do agree with U, it was a bit of a "LAWSY" comment but then I did turn his CSL down in favor of yours, so may be there is a bit of :gayfight: going on :whistle:
I have LOVELY induction noise ALL of the time +1 :whistle:
NO NEED TO SHOUT IN EVERY POST MATT...! :whistle:
mattCSLnut
02-11-2009, 10:32 PM
It also opens with sport 'off' - just at a higher rev bracket.
I removed my flap over a year ago and although i now don't get the night and day sound difference between sport on and off, i do still get a noticeable audible difference when sport is selected on. It may be due to my SS Race silencer, but the noises definitely hardens and gets raspier when sport is on :drool:
Ahhh... THANX GlenDog :thumbs: that's beginning to make some sense. Am I OK to run it as it is or should I get myself a flap and stick it back in for originality ? (as BMW AG intended)
mattCSLnut
02-11-2009, 10:36 PM
Sorry, its you southerners with no sense of humour, :gayfight:
My car is most definitely not for sale, but if it was it would come complete with fully functioning air flap.:birdman::birdman:
Ahhh... but it was when I was looking for a SG CSL few weeks ago, wasn't it. Isn't yours the one with NO speck at all, except the retrofit Angel eyes and Xenons ? +2 :whistle:
mattCSLnut
02-11-2009, 10:38 PM
:blalalala:no need to shout in every post matt...! :whistle:
WHAT ??? :blalalala:
shimmy
02-11-2009, 10:40 PM
look i am sure others will correct me but;
1. i have had 3 intake potentiometers for the flap activation. all three have broekn in about 1 year. I am convinced they give up because they cannot stand the constant strain of opening the flap which is a tightish fit to the intake
2. All it means is that the intake is constantly open and as the intake flap is only there for emissions/noise control (Eliott say noise but i thought it was emissions) who gives a flying ......
3 The Sport button is somehting totally independant and only affects the flap by allowing it to open at around 3500 revs rather than higher (4500-5000 ish???)
4. Sport button adjusts your ECU to give about 25bhp more instantly along with the throttle to give a better response to the throttle pedal. Sport button also changes you exhaust note by modulating the sport exhaust flaps by the exhaust manifold. Finally it hardens your steering rack sensitivity to make it more racey :)
Enjoy :supz:
shane@mbtech
02-11-2009, 10:41 PM
Ahhh... but it was when I was looking for a SG CSL few weeks ago, wasn't it. Isn't yours the one with NO speck at all, except the retrofit Angel eyes and Xenons ? +2 :whistle:
Just as bmw intended. Least mines got an airflap. and my dads better than yours:blalalala:
shane@mbtech
02-11-2009, 10:43 PM
look i am sure others will correct me but;
1. i have had 3 intake potentiometers for the flap activation. all three have broekn in about 1 year. I am convinced they give up because they cannot stand the constant strain of opening the flap which is a tightish fit to the intake
2. All it means is that the intake is constantly open and as the intake flap is only there for emissions/noise control (Eliott say noise but i thought it was emissions) who gives a flying ......
3 The Sport button is somehting totally independant and only affects the flap by allowing it to open at around 3500 revs rather than higher (4500-5000 ish???)
4. Sport button adjusts your ECU to give about 25bhp more instantly along with the throttle to give a better response to the throttle pedal. Sport button also changes you exhaust note by modulating the sport exhaust flaps by the exhaust manifold. Finally it hardens your steering rack sensitivity to make it more racey :)
Enjoy :supz:
Now I know all this Im gonna knock one out all over my flap. :smokin:
glendog74
02-11-2009, 10:43 PM
Ahhh... THANX GlenDog :thumbs: that's beginning to make some sense. Am I OK to run it as it is or should I get myself a flap and stick it back in for originality ? (as BMW AG intended)
I would leave it as it is - flap motor knackered or otherwise. The flap was only ever there to satisfy noise regs as has been mentioned.
The only minor side affect would be that the air filter may get soiled slightly quicker than it would otherwise with flap in place (at lower revs anyway...) Not worth concerning oneself about! :whistle:
mattCSLnut
02-11-2009, 10:46 PM
It also opens with sport 'off' - just at a higher rev bracket.
I removed my flap over a year ago and although i now don't get the night and day sound difference between sport on and off, i do still get a noticeable audible difference when sport is selected on. It may be due to my SS Race silencer, but the noises definitely hardens and gets raspier when sport is on :drool:
All that U describe does happen (without the flap) :smt017
shane@mbtech
02-11-2009, 10:46 PM
Ahhh... but it was when I was looking for a SG CSL few weeks ago, wasn't it. Isn't yours the one with NO speck at all, except the retrofit Angel eyes and Xenons ? +2 :whistle:
Everythings for sale at the right price, tbh im glad you bought someone elses, as it would have been a big mistake selling it. Its too good to sell and will be even better white:beer:
shane@mbtech
02-11-2009, 10:47 PM
All that U describe does happen (without the flap) :smt017
If its true what shimster says the exhaust note changes that will explain the difference you feel.
mattCSLnut
02-11-2009, 10:49 PM
look i am sure others will correct me but;
1. i have had 3 intake potentiometers for the flap activation. all three have broekn in about 1 year. I am convinced they give up because they cannot stand the constant strain of opening the flap which is a tightish fit to the intake
2. All it means is that the intake is constantly open and as the intake flap is only there for emissions/noise control (Eliott say noise but i thought it was emissions) who gives a flying ......
3 The Sport button is somehting totally independant and only affects the flap by allowing it to open at around 3500 revs rather than higher (4500-5000 ish???)
4. Sport button adjusts your ECU to give about 25bhp more instantly along with the throttle to give a better response to the throttle pedal. Sport button also changes you exhaust note by modulating the sport exhaust flaps by the exhaust manifold. Finally it hardens your steering rack sensitivity to make it more racey :)
Enjoy :supz:
Thanx SimmMeister :thumbs: that sounds reasonably sensible :hahaha: Shall I leave it as it is or re-fit the flap where it belongs ?
shane@mbtech
02-11-2009, 10:50 PM
Thanx SimmMeister :thumbs: that sounds reasonably sensible :hahaha: Shall I leave it as it is or re-fit the flap where ti possibly belongs ?
Leave it off you ponce, Mine stopped working, if it did not have full warranty I would just remove it. :thumbs:
mattCSLnut
02-11-2009, 10:52 PM
I would leave it as it is - flap motor knackered or otherwise. The flap was only ever there to satisfy noise regs as has been mentioned.
The only minor side affect would be that the air filter may get soiled slightly quicker than it would otherwise with flap in place (at lower revs anyway...) Not worth concerning oneself about! :whistle:
Fair enough :thumbs: Even lighter without the flap :whistle:
alexk
02-11-2009, 10:54 PM
I thought the flap had another purpose (like in SBK motorbike engines).
When you are with low revs (for example 1500) and you hammer it, it doesn't allow ALL the air to go inside and make the engine to misbehave.
At least in 190hp/lt motorbike engines the purpose is this.
If you just drive in the racetrack (>4500 rpm) you don't need it. But if you drive in the road and accelerate from 1500, 2000, 2500, I think the car runs better with the flap ON.
glendog74
02-11-2009, 10:55 PM
Shall I leave it as it is or re-fit the flap where it belongs ?
Leave it off! :banghead:
Leave it off you ponce, Mine stopped working, if it did not have full warranty I would just remove it. :thumbs:
I have full warranty and no flap - main stealer has always been ok with me. Your stealers must be pants :blalalala:
mattCSLnut
02-11-2009, 11:02 PM
Leave it off! :banghead:
I have full warranty and no flap - main stealer has always been ok with me. Your stealers must be pants :blalalala:
Mine has the Comprehensive BMW Warranty (it always has, from day one) and Full BMW Main Steeler History so I'm guessing it's not an issue with them.
glendog74
02-11-2009, 11:02 PM
When you are with low revs (for example 1500) and you hammer it, it doesn't allow ALL the air to go inside and make the engine to misbehave.
I think the car runs better with the flap ON and i can do a sub-10 minute Ring lap time - thank you please!
If you floor it the flap should fully open in either mode - just does it earlier in Sport mode on.
I never noticed any running difference whatsoever when removing my flap, other than noise.
All this talk of flaps has got me thinking...
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/08/A300-600R_Flaps_jp_001.jpg/800px-A300-600R_Flaps_jp_001.jpg (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/08/A300-600R_Flaps_jp_001.jpg)
:whistle:
shane@mbtech
02-11-2009, 11:06 PM
Leave it off! :banghead:
I have full warranty and no flap - main stealer has always been ok with me. Your stealers must be pants :blalalala:
No,,, It went in with the flap attached but not working, they replaced the potentiometer, I meant if it had no warranty and I would have to pay for the potentiometer I would have just removed the flap... And yes you know the dealer i used is crap. Thats another long story
shane@mbtech
02-11-2009, 11:10 PM
Mine has the Comprehensive BMW Warranty (it always has, from day one) and Full BMW Main Steeler History so I'm guessing it's not an issue with them.
My dealers did not know how the flap operates, totally clueless. tbh i could remove my engine push my car in the workshop and they probably still wouldnt notice.
shimmy
02-11-2009, 11:10 PM
If you just drive in the racetrack (>4500 rpm) you don't need it. But if you drive in the road and accelerate from 1500, 2000, 2500, I think the car runs better with the flap ON.
My sport button (default ON) def makes cold driving a little more jumpy but i have never noticed any difference in the running of the engine without the flap:smokin:.
Why then has the M3 E46 standard model not got one!
shimmy
02-11-2009, 11:13 PM
look i am sure others will correct me but;
1. i have had 3 intake potentiometers for the flap activation. all three have broekn in about 1 year. I am convinced they give up because they cannot stand the constant strain of opening the flap which is a tightish fit to the intake
2. All it means is that the intake is constantly open and as the intake flap is only there for emissions/noise control (Eliott say noise but i thought it was emissions) who gives a flying ......
3 The Sport button is somehting totally independant and only affects the flap by allowing it to open at around 3500 revs rather than higher (4500-5000 ish???)
4. Sport button adjusts your ECU to give about 25bhp more instantly along with the throttle to give a better response to the throttle pedal. Sport button also changes you exhaust note by modulating the sport exhaust flaps by the exhaust manifold. Finally it hardens your steering rack sensitivity to make it more racey :) - COMPLETE LIE
Enjoy
Sorry just noticed that my item 4 is not true at all :thumbs:
mattCSLnut
02-11-2009, 11:14 PM
My dealers did not know how the flap operates, totally clueless. tbh i could remove my engine push my car in the workshop and they probably still wouldnt notice.
They would probably do an Oil & Filter change and charge U dearly for it, despite NO engine :hahaha: :hahaha: :hahaha: Some Main Steelers are better then others or worst then the rest, why U bother giving business to your utterly clueless lot is beyond me :smt017
shane@mbtech
02-11-2009, 11:15 PM
My sport button (default ON) def makes cold driving a little more jumpy but i have never noticed any difference in the running of the engine without the flap:smokin:.
Why then has the M3 E46 standard model not got one!
Completely different air intake shimmy, different ecu, engine management and the e46 m3 runs a maf/airmass.
mattCSLnut
02-11-2009, 11:15 PM
Sorry just noticed that my item 4 is not true at all :thumbs:
Convincing never the less :hahaha: so what's the truth :whistle:
shane@mbtech
02-11-2009, 11:17 PM
They would probably do an Oil & Filter change and charge U dearly for it, despite NO engine :hahaha: :hahaha: :hahaha: Some Main Steelers are better then others or worst then the rest, why U bother giving business to your utterly clueless lot is beyond me :smt017
Im not anymore trust me, the worse thing about it is I would do it all myself but why should I with the warranty. If a faulty part costs less than £100 ill buy it and fit myself, I hate putting car in the main dealers, I worked in one and know the distinct lack of care customers cars get.
shimmy
02-11-2009, 11:37 PM
Convincing never the less :hahaha: so what's the truth :whistle:
Sport button on CSL i believe just allows the flap to open earlier in the rev range and adjusts the throttle sensitivity
BUT Glendogs car apparently also gets louder :bigcry::bigcry:WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
but that is probably because as you press the button, the throttle adjusts and if your foot stays still you will be pulling it to higher revs hence the engine will start to get noisier
glendog74
02-11-2009, 11:46 PM
but that is probably because as you press the button, the throttle adjusts and if your foot stays still you will be pulling it to higher revs hence the engine will start to get noisier
Probably... :birdman:
DuncanR
06-11-2009, 06:26 PM
I too am ...flapless ! Since day 1, so i only know one noise ... ;)
DazBlackCSL
06-11-2009, 06:32 PM
FLAPS :whistle: Hmmmmm
shimmy
06-11-2009, 06:34 PM
got more flaps than i know what to do with :thumbs:
Nords
13-11-2009, 01:15 AM
Sport button on CSL i believe just allows the flap to open earlier in the rev range and adjusts the throttle sensitivity
BUT Glendogs car apparently also gets louder :bigcry::bigcry:WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
but that is probably because as you press the button, the throttle adjusts and if your foot stays still you will be pulling it to higher revs hence the engine will start to get noisier
It does get noisier, it makes the noise at 4 to 5K that it would at 7K without the button. To explain what I mean, leave the sport button off and rev the car out in third. Around 7K (ish) the noise will change significantly as the flap opens. With sport on, it makes this louder noise, even at very low revs if you put your foot right down...
3wheels3
13-11-2009, 02:59 AM
I have 65% flap.
mattCSLnut
16-11-2009, 06:05 PM
I too am ...flapless ! Since day 1, so i only know one noise ... ;)
Well, as of today I'm no longer "Flap Less" :thumbs: Thanx to Nathan my CSL has the original intake flap back in place. Can I check if it opens with the car static ? Engine On, SPORTS button On and rev to 4000 rpm ? What's the right way to do this ?
Thorney
16-11-2009, 06:28 PM
Just drive it, hold at 4500rpm with sport off, hit sport button and note will change immediately.
mattCSLnut
16-11-2009, 07:43 PM
Just drive it, hold at 4500rpm with sport off, hit sport button and note will change immediately.
OK, thanx but this kind of thing happened when I was running without the flap. Driving along, press SPORTS button and it was as if a turbo came on :thumbs:. Change of engine note plus extra surge :smt017
shane@mbtech
16-11-2009, 09:54 PM
OK, thanx but this kind of thing happened when I was running without the flap. Driving along, press SPORTS button and it was as if a turbo came on :thumbs:. Change of engine note plus extra surge :smt017
Engine running, get someone to full throttle, you will see the flap open and the noise changes dramatically:thumbs:, now stop being a fanny and just drive the fecking thing:gayfight:
mattCSLnut
17-11-2009, 12:06 AM
Engine running, get someone to full throttle, you will see the flap open and the noise changes dramatically:thumbs:, now stop being a fanny and just drive the fecking thing:gayfight:
I'm doing my best :hahaha: 1300 miles since I bought her a month ago and it's only meant to be my weekend toy :whistle:
cslgirl
17-11-2009, 12:56 PM
My flap's intact!
Here is a picture of my open flap...
:whistle:
http://www.ilovefastcars.com/mediapool/77/770913/images/n563165212_65327_8605.jpg
Sorry, I couldn't leave this thread without saying that...:hahaha:
mattCSLnut
17-11-2009, 01:20 PM
My flap's intact!
Here is a picture of my open flap...
:whistle:
http://www.ilovefastcars.com/mediapool/77/770913/images/n563165212_65327_8605.jpg
Sorry, I couldn't leave this thread without saying that...:hahaha:
Uhhhh :hahaha: U do say all the right things :whistle: Joking aside, how did U get it to open like that while U took the picture ?
cslgirl
17-11-2009, 01:29 PM
lol
Husband took the pic whilst I revved.
mattCSLnut
17-11-2009, 01:32 PM
lol
Husband took the pic whilst I revved.
Any particular RPM to achieve this ? :whistle:
cslgirl
17-11-2009, 02:10 PM
hmmmmmmmmm think it was about 2500 to 3000:thumbs:
mattCSLnut
17-11-2009, 03:12 PM
hmmmmmmmmm think it was about 2500 to 3000:thumbs:
cool :thumbs: thanx
vBulletin® v3.8.1, Copyright ©2000-2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.