Help please re legal action

[Cosworth50]

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[Cosworth50]

Any specialist solicitors in this field anyone can recommend?

I even told the chap I'd been messed about with before and specifically asked him for his word that he would stick to the agreement is sell it to me and left the deposit on that basis.

Thanks all.

[LeinsCSL]

Best of luck with that one. Just be thankful you're not buying a house from him

[Cosworth50]

Best of luck with that one. Just be thankful you're not buying a house from him

Thanks. he even said to me he was a 'man of his word' and I double double checked with him and told him about how it had happened before. I wouldn't have the nerve to do that.

This isn't however about morality it is about a legal issue and any legal rights I have.

Fortunately I have all text messages confirming everything and our agreement so I'm going to make some calls tomorrow morning - on principle as much as anything. Trust it to be an estate agent!

[LHutchin]

Sorry to hear about your experience, seems to be the way of the used car buying world sadly :sad:

[Diamondgeezer]

I feel sorry for you mate

Is that the potential new owner who's posting on the other thread ?

Might be an idea to have a word with him to get his version

Wish you luck

[Cosworth50]

I feel sorry for you mate

Is that the potential new owner who's posting on the other thread ?

Might be an idea to have a word with him to get his version

Wish you luck

Yes, I have no problem with the other chap who bought the car naturally as he wasn't to know.

Ben, the seller, told me that he had reneged on the deal with me as his brother in law wanted to buy it so he sold it to his brother in law as 'it's family'.

I have obviously quickly established that this was not/is not the case and that the seller was just spinning me another line.

The gents at Redish will be waiting for Ben to take the car in for the inspection tomorrow so they have been messed about with too. It's a shame.

[Diamondgeezer]

If it was me I'd put it down as a bad experience and move on as you'll only drive yourself mad

Bide your time and wait for the next one to come along

Let as many people as possible know your looking and hopefully someone will contact you before it's put up for sale

Anyway good luck and don't let it eat away at you there's some f#cked up people out there

[mattCSLnut]

Thanks. he even said to me he was a 'man of his word' and I double double checked with him and told him about how it had happened before. I wouldn't have the nerve to do that.

This isn't however about morality it is about a legal issue and any legal rights I have.

Fortunately I have all text messages confirming everything and our agreement so I'm going to make some calls tomorrow morning - on principle as much as anything. Trust it to be an estate agent!

Well that's not much to go on if his every other word is BS or lies + he's an Estate agent so he'll tell you whatever you want to hear ;) it's not as if they are not known for it :whistle:

In all seriousness though and without wanting to sound defeatist, save yourself a lot of hustle and money on legal fees and walk away. It's simply not worth it even if you got it for a below market price. Don't let that be your only motivator as it'll end up costing you way more than a proper, straight CSL owned by an honest CSLR member :thumbs: ... plus you'll always have a bitter feeling attached to this car if you keep on fighting for your legal rights.

While I too believe in principles and you may very well have the legal righty to go through with the purchase because you've paid a deposit on the car + have paperwork to prove it... why on earth would you want to deal with this "man of his word" guy or trust in anything he's told you so far. Clearly he is being dishonest and Redish will no doubt find lots of crack in the rear sub frame + whatever else is wrong with this car, which he may already know about. There's also potential added danger (depending on how mental this chap is) he might cause some deliberate damage to the car or it's engine (while you fight your legal fight) that you wont know about until it's too late.

If I were you I'd focus my energy elsewhere as this is simply not worth it, all thing considered & IMHO :smokin:

[nw99]

Such bad luck good luck with your search

[Cosworth50]

All sound advice gents thanks.

The issue is that sometimes, just sometimes, cost and logic go out the window when someone annoys you so much.

What more did the chap want? It went on pistonheads and within an hour or two of the advert going live he had a deposit in his bank account. The very next day I spoke with James at a redish and booked it in for the very next slot they had free. I confirmed this with Ben, the seller, and he agreed and okayed everything.

I was then due to go and pick it up this coming weekend or, as I told Ben, send a trailer down for it this week.

I did not quibble or ask for a 'best price' I offered to pay full whack on condition he was a gentleman which, he assured me he was.

A seller can't expect much more than that.

I will speak with a solicitor tomorrow because I feel so passionately about it.

If anyone has a lower owner, decent example that is a gent and wants to deal with a fellow, no nonsense, cash buyer please get in touch and restore my faith in humanity :)

[AbidK]

All sound advice gents thanks.

The issue is that sometimes, just sometimes, cost and logic go out the window when someone annoys you so much.

What more did the chap want? It went on pistonheads and within an hour or two of the advert going live he had a deposit in his bank account. The very next day I spoke with James at a redish and booked it in for the very next slot they had free. I confirmed this with Ben, the seller, and he agreed and okayed everything.

I was then due to go and pick it up this coming weekend or, as I told Ben, send a trailer down for it this week.

I did not quibble or ask for a 'best price' I offered to pay full whack on condition he was a gentleman which, he assured me he was.

A seller can't expect much more than that.

I will speak with a solicitor tomorrow because I feel so passionately about it.

If anyone has a lower owner, decent example that is a gent and wants to deal with a fellow, no nonsense, cash buyer please get in touch and restore my faith in humanity :)

I agree with you when someone annoys me then I will pursue a matter if only for nuisance value.

I went to see this car last night and had a good look around it, seller said he wasn't overly fussed about selling as had a friends garage he could use.

I didn't bother to ask for a test drive as for some reason it just didn't all add up. This was purchased to be kept for investment but then space became a problem then it wasn't a problem etc.

Has definitely had some serious money spent on it I don't know if thats a good thing or bad, by that I mean whether its had a harsh life which is why the money has had to be spent on it.

Also no paperwork to back up the work done to the floor just the dealers 'word'!

[plumber vic]

If treats you like that he got no respect for you or his car
shit man shit car lucky escape (buy from someone on regester)
Lifes short :thumbs::thumbs:

[Matt21]

Never had a warm and fuzzy feeling on this car. Always seems for sale!

Fate must have meant it wasn't yours. Move on and get ready for the next one!

[Yanto]

Time waster.

Fuck him off, plaster the reg plate over here and cutters to help any future buyers.

Draw a line under it and move on. Life's too short.

Part of the pleasure of the buying process is securing a loved car from an enthusiast...not a chancer.

Be patient and procure the right car from the right guy (or gal). :beer:

[cslsuperfan]

Time waster.

Fuck him off, plaster the reg plate over here and cutters to help any future buyers.

Draw a line under it and move on. Life's too short.

Part of the pleasure of the buying process is securing a loved car from an enthusiast...not a chancer.

Be patient and procure the right car from the right guy (or gal). :beer:


Cosworth

Yanto has summarised your situation.

I know you want a csl yesterday but come September they'll be at least one or 2 forum members saying goodbye to their car's.

This spring saw a couple of cracking forum owned cars change hands.

Plan for Spring 2016......:thumbs:

[Mark CSL]

When buying a car go see it pay and drive home dont give them the chance to change there mind os sell to someone else :whistle:

The 1 for you will still be out there :thumbs:

[nw942]

Same thing happened to me earlier this year with a dealer SOR car and it was quite frustrating. One of the reasons given was that 'the new buyer doesn't insist on a inspection', so either they wanted to avoid the hassle or there was something to hide.

So I would assume in your case the new buyer is paying more and/or they do not want an inspection. If they are paying the same then perhaps they should get it inspected :whistle:

As others have said this happens all the time unfortunately. I'd sleep on it and I'm sure that tomorrow you won't want to spend any more time/money on this chap.

[Neil M]

Walk away and forget about it, (it didn't have your name on it) put it down to experience and save yourself the hassle and expense, not to mention the aggravation, frustration and headaches. :whistle:

I wouldn't be at all surprised if the seller was a closet car dealer.

[Neil M]

Has definitely had some serious money spent on it I don't know if that's a good thing or bad, by that I mean whether its had a harsh life which is why the money has had to be spent on it.

The car was Mr Sagmans aka Ian, who was completely OCD when it came to his CSL everything that didn't meet his expectation was replaced eg. Screws, bolts, clips, sill trims etc... It was polished more than it was driven, all the invoices illustrated will be his. I've met Ian (Smashing Lad even though he was from Liverpool) although he wasn't in his CSL (I was) and if he's reading these posts he will be more than a little annoyed. ;)

[Cosworth50]

Hi all,

Spoke to new owner on here who left a deposit yesterday and I did the gentlemanly thing and let him have the car even though I put down the deposit first. Clearly he didn't know I had left a deposit so it's nothing to do with him.

At least I acted with honesty and integrity and I hope the new owner enjoys the car. Some of us still use our word as our bond although it is a dying concept.

My deposit has been refunded by the seller with a further £100 goodwill from him and I have deleted his name from the original post. I'm not happy with this outcome but I have helped another CSL register member get the car and he got it for £33k not the £33995 I had agreed in principle.

It looked a good car to be fair so I can't criticise that although it's not been inspected so thee could be bills lurking, there may not be, who knows.

If anyone has an SG car that they want to sell please PM me, I'd prefer grey to black but either will do.

Mods, you can close the thread now.

Thanks

[Cosworth50]

Same thing happened to me earlier this year with a dealer SOR car and it was quite frustrating. One of the reasons given was that 'the new buyer doesn't insist on a inspection', so either they wanted to avoid the hassle or there was something to hide.

So I would assume in your case the new buyer is paying more and/or they do not want an inspection. If they are paying the same then perhaps they should get it inspected :whistle:

As others have said this happens all the time unfortunately. I'd sleep on it and I'm sure that tomorrow you won't want to spend any more time/money on this chap.

The new buyer is paying £1,000 less but didn't want an inspection.

[LeinsCSL]

Fair play, there should hopefully be a bucketful of good car karma heading your way now - the right CSL for you will be out there

[AbidK]

The new buyer is paying £1,000 less but didn't want an inspection.

Seller took £995 less to avoid inspection after you agreed a deal, makes you wonder why. I just hope there isn't any issues with it.


I personally wouldn't buy one without a inspection but then maybe thats because I'm not very hands on.

[billyboysm3]

The new buyer is paying £1,000 less but didn't want an inspection.

Anyone who knows there stuff will not buy one of these without an inspection.

Car maybe fine but after that comment you might of got away lightly.

A simple pressure test is a must.

[cslsuperfan]

Anyone who knows there stuff will not buy one of these without an inspection.

Car maybe fine but after that comment you might of got away lightly.

A simple pressure test is a must.

CSL Bible references.

Gareth does the shake down.

Any genuine seller wold be more than happy for a potential new owner to have the car professionally inspected.

I would personally take the car to the garage of his/her choice. It's the best way to reassure the buyer that all is well and if something is not A1, a realistic and accurate costing is given.

[erdingtonjohn]

Always get someone to go through it before handing over the money.

They are not cheap motors to repair if something goes wrong and it could be off the road for a while if parts are on back order.

I have learn't the hard way...

[kman]

Ok guys, I was the "other buyer" in this situation. It was all going swimmingly until I saw the first post in this thread and realised I and Cosworth were being messed about and we've been chatting since.

I;ve had a think and decided not to buy the car - I've just put a deposit down on a 1M. Hopefully this all goes well!

Good luck to anyone interested in the car, it seems like a good one and a good price despite the antics.

[outnumbered]

Any genuine seller wold be more than happy for a potential new owner to have the car professionally inspected.



I'm not sure that I would be, given the current situation where there's a lot of demand for CSL and little supply.

Arranging an inspection is extra hassle, assuming the car has to go off somewhere to get looked at. If there are plenty of willing buyers out there, then why would a seller want to spend their time helping to get the car inspected ?

I'm not defending the original seller accepting a deposit and then reneging, but in his position, I'd probably have just said that I wasn't interested in any inspection that didn't take place on my drive.

[GregorFuk]

I'm not sure that I would be, given the current situation where there's a lot of demand for CSL and little supply.

Arranging an inspection is extra hassle, assuming the car has to go off somewhere to get looked at. If there are plenty of willing buyers out there, then why would a seller want to spend their time helping to get the car inspected ?

I'm not defending the original seller accepting a deposit and then reneging, but in his position, I'd probably have just said that I wasn't interested in any inspection that didn't take place on my drive.

I'm in agreement. It's just a load of hassle and there are a lot of time wasters out there.

[LHutchin]

I'm in agreement. It's just a load of hassle and there are a lot of time wasters out there.

Surely if a prospective buyer is spending several hundred pounds on an inspection this indicates they are serious?

[AbidK]

Ok guys, I was the "other buyer" in this situation. It was all going swimmingly until I saw the first post in this thread and realised I and Cosworth were being messed about and we've been chatting since.

I;ve had a think and decided not to buy the car - I've just put a deposit down on a 1M. Hopefully this all goes well!

Good luck to anyone interested in the car, it seems like a good one and a good price despite the antics.

Now I see why it was showing quite high up on new ads on PH.

Seller probably feels a little silly now and rightly so.

[Diamondgeezer]

Surely if a prospective buyer is spending several hundred pounds on an inspection this indicates they are serious?

I feel very lucky that the guy I bought from was a man his word
We agreed a price in principle and arranged to have the car inspected

I never left a deposit it was just a gentlemens agreement

I find it a little strange that in today's world this is not enough

Why wouldn't you go out of your way to help someone who is spending thousands on your car ?? Surely it's to the benefit of both party's

[mattCSLnut]

Ok guys, I was the "other buyer" in this situation. It was all going swimmingly until I saw the first post in this thread and realised I and Cosworth were being messed about and we've been chatting since.

I;ve had a think and decided not to buy the car - I've just put a deposit down on a 1M. Hopefully this all goes well!

Good luck to anyone interested in the car, it seems like a good one and a good price despite the antics.

That's what I call poetic justice :thumbs: The seller got exactly what he deserved :whistle:

[Cosworth50]

Sorry to hear it kman.

Sounds like we are all feeling a little deflated about this. The seller, me and you. The joke is we have all lost out. What made you pull out as you sounded keen on the phone?

I would have LOVED to be in that car now on such a glorious day as today and the seller could have had money in his bank and Redish could have earned the money from the inspection. Win, win, win all round.

On the flip side, some positive news, today I viewed and offered on a house, the seller accepted and I know he had a higher offer later on today and he has stuck with me as he said his 'word is his bond' so I suppose a little good karma has come back my way.

I'm still here looking for a CSL.

:beer:

[cslsuperfan]

Sorry to hear it kman.

Sounds like we are all feeling a little deflated about this. The seller, me and you. The joke is we have all lost out. What made you pull out as you sounded keen on the phone?

I would have LOVED to be in that car now on such a glorious day as today and the seller could have had money in his bank and Redish could have earned the money from the inspection. Win, win, win all round.

On the flip side, some positive news, today I viewed and offered on a house, the seller accepted and I know he had a higher offer later on today and he has stuck with me as he said his 'word is his bond' so I suppose a little good karma has come back my way.

I'm still here looking for a CSL.

:beer:

Cosworth

would you not reconsider this car as it's now available?

[Cosworth50]

Cosworth

would you not reconsider this car as it's now available?

I want to as I would love a CSL to enjoy the nice weather in but how do I know the same thing wouldn't happen again? The guys at redish would be put out again, id waste my time looking at hotels etc and, also, it's left a bit of a sour taste.

My idea of car buying is go down and meet the seller at their nice home, have a chat about cars and a nice cuppa and to know the seller and feel like we have got on and could look after each other and, whilst obviously not becoming friends, becoming people that we know and bump into at car shows and part of the register/club and to have that experience. It would be a bit awkward meeting the seller now as we had a bit of a (albeit civil) disagreement. There is a lot of trust when laying out £30 odd grand for an 11 year old BMW and I want to feel comfortable about doing that and I no longer think I do with this car.

Kman agreed £33k and turned it down and I agreed £33995 so I'd feel stupid Paying over the odds.

Who knows, we could all still win out of it and things could be put right. The seller comes on here so could PM me if he wanted to work out a deal although he may have sold it to someone else already, who knows. I have no hard feelings as life is too short but I think it may be best for me to deal with another register member.

[nw99]

Bide your time another car will come up for sale

[GregorFuk]

It's a sad state of affairs but don't blame a hunk of metal for it's owners indiscretions. If the car meets you requirements then stump up the cash and Foxtrot Oscar, I'm sure you'll live without making one more casual acquaintance.

If the car turns out to need it subframe done then £1400+VAT at Redish is hardly the end of the world and you can likely do a few more maintenance jobs in the process (thinking brake pipes, bushes etc etc).

These are old cars now and they will have issues. I'm not sure what an inspection really tells you that you can't foresee yourself.

[Rick H]

It's a sad state of affairs but don't blame a hunk of metal for it's owners indiscretions. If the car meets you requirements then stump up the cash and Foxtrot Oscar, I'm sure you'll live without making one more casual acquaintance.

If the car turns out to need it subframe done then £1400+VAT at Redish is hardly the end of the world and you can likely do a few more maintenance jobs in the process (thinking brake pipes, bushes etc etc).

These are old cars now and they will have issues. I'm not sure what an inspection really tells you that you can't foresee yourself.

This is sense.

[outnumbered]

As this car was for sale at a dealer 6 months ago with 64000 up, it'd be worth any buyer understanding why the current owner is selling so quickly.

Maybe he was just scratching an itch, ticking a box, or whatever people do, but another way of looking at it is that he's only done 700 miles in it, and he's selling in the prime CSL usage season. We know he declined an inspection and agreed a lower price with someone else.

[Cosworth50]

It's a sad state of affairs but don't blame a hunk of metal for it's owners indiscretions. If the car meets you requirements then stump up the cash and Foxtrot Oscar, I'm sure you'll live without making one more casual acquaintance.

If the car turns out to need it subframe done then £1400+VAT at Redish is hardly the end of the world and you can likely do a few more maintenance jobs in the process (thinking brake pipes, bushes etc etc).

These are old cars now and they will have issues. I'm not sure what an inspection really tells you that you can't foresee yourself.

Very true, it depends how you view life i suppose.

Without an inspection I wouldn't know the compression, any leaks of oil, what it was like underneath, the boot floor, the engine number, the smg , suspension, brakes etc. someone that has these cars on ramps all day long would spot things us mortals wouldn't even notice.

It takes a bold man, in my humble opinion, to just splurge £30k plus on what is an old e46 after just a short test drive. Many people do it, but we are getting to the stage where most people will be wanting inspections etc.

I may be wrong, who knows, but I'd want an inspection for my peace of mind.

[cslsuperfan]

Very true, it depends how you view life i suppose.

Without an inspection I wouldn't know the compression, any leaks of oil, what it was like underneath, the boot floor, the engine number, the smg , suspension, brakes etc. someone that has these cars on ramps all day long would spot things us mortals wouldn't even notice.

It takes a bold man, in my humble opinion, to just splurge £30k plus on what is an old e46 after just a short test drive. Many people do it, but we are getting to the stage where most people will be wanting inspections etc.

I may be wrong, who knows, but I'd want an inspection for my peace of mind.


Steady Cozzzie! What you're referring to is probably the best car BM have made ;)

seriously though if you want an inspection you have one.