Broken Rear Spring ho hum

[Rick H]

MoT failure on busted rear spring . . . :bigcry:

Best place to buy oem?

cheers in advance :beer:

[billyboysm3]

Dealership but I think they are out :(

[mattCSLnut]

MoT failure on busted rear spring . . . :bigcry:

Best place to buy oem?

cheers in advance :beer:

For OEM it's the Main Stealers I'm afraid :banghead: and idealy you'd want a matching pair for even ride height :thumbs: ... the problem is they will brake again, eventually.
Mines had 3 sets of OEM rear springs, all under warranty :smokin:
Also while you're there check the condition / rebound of your OEM rear shocks as they will most probably be worn out making the rear springs work that much harder, hence the broken spring.

[Trawler]

Dealership but I think they are out :(

.thats what I heard. No springs anywhere. :bigcry:

[cslsuperfan]

MoT failure on busted rear spring . . . :bigcry:

Best place to buy oem?

cheers in advance :beer:

Rick

Simpson MS/Bartlett's may have a set in stock.

[mattCSLnut]

.thats what I heard. No springs anywhere. :bigcry:
If that is the case then it may be a good time to upgrade :whistle:

[CraigMillwardCroft]

Dealership but I think they are out :(

Every thing is sold out when you give your name :whistle:

[glendog74]

If that is the case then it may be a good time to upgrade :whistle:

+1 :thumbs:

[Mark CSL]

Every thing is sold out when you give your name :whistle:
:hahaha::hahaha::hahaha::hahaha::hahaha::hahaha::h ahaha::hahaha::hahaha::hahaha::hahaha::hahaha:

[shimmy]

Every thing is sold out when you give your name :whistle:

from here on in he shall be known as "back order billy' :finga:

[Rick H]

Thanks guys . . . I didn't realise there was an issue with ordering - thats no bloody good. I'll speak to the dealer tommoz and see what the waiting time is, and check Simpsons/Bartletts too, cheers Ben.

Good point about the rear dampers - well worth a check, from memory they aren't that old but I'll check the paperwork. No leakage was noted by the tester.

Yes, great time to upgrade - love those Bilsteins, where are they from? Do they stiffen the ride too much though? I looked at the H&R ones Simpsons are punting for about £400 - are they worthwhile?

[mattCSLnut]

Good point about the rear dampers - well worth a check, from memory they aren't that old but I'll check the paperwork. No leakage was noted by the tester.

Yes, great time to upgrade - love those Bilsteins, where are they from? Do they stiffen the ride too much though? I looked at the H&R ones Simpsons are punting for about £400 - are they worthwhile?


The rear dampers don't need to have oil leaks to be worm out Rick ;) My original 12 year old ones are bone dry but one of them doesn't rebound at all and the other one is so slow it's not worth waiting for ;) BTW they have only done 70K (UK pothole) miles to be like that :banghead:

Re: Billys ride height adjustable springs... they are part of my PSS10 kit ... and no they don't over stiffen the ride as they are fully adjustable from 0 = soft to 10 = hard so you can choose your rebound rate :thumbs:
This is what they looked like when I bought them New 4 years ago. They are a little bit used now but in perfect condition and may be available FOR SALE soon :whistle:

[NZ_M3]

My original 12 year old ones are bone dry but one of them doesn't rebound at all and the other one is so slow it's not worth waiting for ;)

The stock rear dampers have a really high rebound rate, so they are VERY slow to come back up. The design of them also means that they don't actually function like you would normally expect. Bit like a race damper, push them down and they don't actually bounce back up - it's the way that the valving works.

[shimmy]

The stock rear dampers have a really high rebound rate, so they are VERY slow to come back up. The design of them also means that they don't actually function like you would normally expect. Bit like a race damper, push them down and they don't actually bounce back up - it's the way that the valving works.

I think stock dampers are a marvel tbh, great on the car in many conditions without adjustment.

[mattCSLnut]

The stock rear dampers have a really high rebound rate, so they are VERY slow to come back up. The design of them also means that they don't actually function like you would normally expect. Bit like a race damper, push them down and they don't actually bounce back up - it's the way that the valving works.

I'm not sure I follow Tom ;) Both Bilstein & the brand new OEM dampers do rebound very progressively and normally as in not painfully slowly however after 6 + years and 70K pothole ridden UK roads miles my original 2003 rear dampers are toast... to be fair any damper would be. Manufacturers (including BMW )only warranty such parts up to 60K miles so that's a good indicator of the life span of these things.
FYI I've just bought a set of OEM (CSL specific) rear dampers from BMW main stealers (not the pretend ones off eBay :whistle: ) and the rebound is very much there by comparison to the old dampers which as I've mentioned before are dead... at least one of them, for sure :smt023
First pic shows you a comparison between Bilstein PSS10 rear damper (on the left) Original 2003 in the middle and the brand new OEM replacement (on the right).

[NZ_M3]

I have a brand new unused set of CSL shocks and springs in my possession so I know exactly what you are talking about Matt.

I believe the new style CSL shocks have a different valving system compared to the originals - see video below (top new style, bottom old style shocks - both shocks are brand new - notice the rebound differences - this is a valving style difference). If you physically compared the shocks they are constructed differently also.

The original shocks on my car were removed by me when the car had only done 10k km so practically brand new and I can tell you for a fact that the rebound on them were very slow (I have removed enough stock CSL shocks and seen them behave this way enough to know that they were not like your usual shocks and that this characteristics is normal for the original shocks from the CSL)

Video
http://vid115.photobucket.com/albums/n319/M3_Power/Video_zpsehcsacph.mp4

Go grab a set of race shocks from kw or similar style valving and push them down next time and you'll be waiting for eternity for them to rebound.

[Chappers]

I ordered a pair of rear springs on Thursday and was told 7-10 days. My car won't pass the (expired) MOT without them so let's see what happens. It's currently sitting on the lawn until I get them...

[mattCSLnut]

I have a brand new unused set of CSL shocks and springs in my possession so I know exactly what you are talking about Matt.

I believe the new style CSL shocks have a different valving system compared to the originals - see video below (top new style, bottom old style shocks - both shocks are brand new - notice the rebound differences - this is a valving style difference). If you physically compared the shocks they are constructed differently also.

The original shocks on my car were removed by me when the car had only done 10k km so practically brand new and I can tell you for a fact that the rebound on them were very slow (I have removed enough stock CSL shocks and seen them behave this way enough to know that they were not like your usual shocks and that this characteristics is normal for the original shocks from the CSL)

Video
http://vid115.photobucket.com/albums/n319/M3_Power/Video_zpsehcsacph.mp4

Go grab a set of race shocks from kw or similar style valving and push them down next time and you'll be waiting for eternity for them to rebound.

Good to know we're on the same page ;) and funny you should mention this Tom because the first pair of OEM rear dampers that arrived directly from Germany was a mix of one New (original 2003, 12 year old Old stock) and one revised New (New 2013 New stock) :banghead: Alex (karbonkid) had the same experience, so this may be their unique way of getting rid of old stock ;)
Like youself, I did a comparison rebound test with both of these shock side by side and the original 2003 stock was indeed much slower by comparison to the Newer 2013 revised, almost 50% slower than the other. Obviously I wasn't happy with this so I asked for the parts guy to re order another set but request they are a matching set. In fact I (and my OCD) ;) would have preferred a pair of matching OEM old stock original CSL dampers for absolute originality as they have the correct (slower) rebound, plus the label with "M3 CSL" stamped on them as well as SACHS the OE manufacturer which the newer units don't. The practical me however thought it might be better to have a fresher dampers with newer rubber seals, oils & gasses instead of the 12 year old New old stock. Was that a mistake ? and should I have insisted on a pair of the original Old stock dampers ? :whistle:
Some pix here to show the differences between the two.

[mattCSLnut]

I ordered a pair of rear springs on Thursday and was told 7-10 days. My car won't pass the (expired) MOT without them so let's see what happens. It's currently sitting on the lawn until I get them...

Sounds like they are coming direct from Germany as this is the period I had to wait for my OEM rear dampers recently... twice :banghead: ... although the second time round they arrived within 5 days :smt023 and were a matching pair :thumbs: which was a bonus.

[GregorFuk]

I am planning on doing a suspension refresh this winter and was going to go with OEM dampers as I have no idea what I'm doing with regards to suspension adjustment and figured BMW do.

Seem now like I man not be getting the real deal CSL dampers even if I do go OEM. So what now? Bilstein or Ohlin would be my choice as I don't want to go to full coil overs on the rear but neither of these manufacturers seem to offer a CSL specific kit, they only cater for the normal M3. This bothers me somewhat. Does anybody know if the KW CSL kit differs from their normal M3 offering? And can anybody advise on the above?

[billyboysm3]

So if you order CSL Dampers are you just getting standard Sach shocks?

Just with CSL Part number?

[mattCSLnut]

So if you order CSL Dampers are you just getting standard Sachs shocks?

Just with CSL Part number?

I don't think so Billy. According to Nick @ Elms parts dept. they are still CSL specific although the part number has been changes ever so slightly in the past 12 years (which is quite a common practice) the original being: 3152 2282 507 and the revised : 3352 2282 507.

[mattCSLnut]

I've just checked the current part numbers on RealOEM and the standard E46 M3 Coupe with the same build date as my CSL (July 2003) has a different rear damper part number: 3352 2283 105 as oppose to: 3352 2282 705 which is the current CSL rear damper part number (not the original 2003 item)

[GregorFuk]

I've just checked the current part numbers on RealOEM and the standard E46 M3 Coupe with the same build date as my CSL (July 2003) has a different rear damper part number: 3352 2283 105 as oppose to: 3352 2282 705 which is the current CSL rear damper part number (not the original 2003 item)

And the front?

[cslsuperfan]

Matt

Learning has taken place.

Great thread for peeps not in the know.:thumbs:

[Chappers]

Just (two hours ago) been to pick up my rear springs (ordered Thursday afternoon), so that was quite a bit quicker than 7-10 days!

[mattCSLnut]

And the front?

DIY here: http://www.realoem.com/bmw/select.do

[NZ_M3]

CSL dampers are shorter than the standard M3 items by quite a bit. Put them side by side and the difference is obvious.

If you order new now you are still getting the same dampers, just constructed differently with different valving system - if you chuck them on the dyno they would read exactly the same as the original dampers - have been meaning to do this actually.

Just because they return from a compressed state differently DOES NOT mean its rebound rate is different. It's the way that valving works - the return rate is still the same. Don't let the way it rebounds makes you think that the energy it takes to extend the shock is different. That IS NOT the rate of rebound and is most certainly not how it is measured!!

[Rick H]

Spring has Sprung :thumbs:

[mattCSLnut]

Matt

Learning has taken place.

Great thread for peeps not in the know.:thumbs:

Feels good doesn't it ? :smokin:

[mattCSLnut]

Spring has Sprung :thumbs:
Congrats :thumbs: but just the one ? :whistle:

[glendog74]

I am planning on doing a suspension refresh this winter and was going to go with OEM dampers as I have no idea what I'm doing with regards to suspension adjustment and figured BMW do.

Seem now like I man not be getting the real deal CSL dampers even if I do go OEM. So what now? Bilstein or Ohlin would be my choice as I don't want to go to full coil overs on the rear but neither of these manufacturers seem to offer a CSL specific kit, they only cater for the normal M3. This bothers me somewhat. Does anybody know if the KW CSL kit differs from their normal M3 offering? And can anybody advise on the above?

KW is generic fit for E46 M3/M3 CSL - it does keep the separate spring and damper setup at the rear in line with BMW design.

[Rick H]

Congrats :thumbs: but just the one ? :whistle:

Pair, pick them up in the morning from Williams Stockport.

Rear pads too.

[mattCSLnut]

Pair, pick them up in the morning from Williams Stockport.

Rear pads too.
Good news :beer: and if you're handy with spanners it's a 5 minute job (per side) to fit the new springs.

[J2LTB]

Whats do BMW charge for the new rear dampers ? My bump stops are crumbling.

[mattCSLnut]

What do BMW charge for the new rear dampers ? My bump stops are crumbling.

They are about £180 inc VAT each ... before any discount :whistle:

Don't be tempted by the ones on eBay miss-advertised as CSL rear dampers for around £210 for the pair as they are not for the CSL and the seller is a bit of a B.S. Billy :whistle:

[J2LTB]

They are about £180 inc VAT each ... before any discount :whistle:

Don't be tempted by the ones on eBay miss-advertised as CSL rear dampers for around £210 for the pair as they are not for the CSL and the seller is a bit of a B.S. Billy :whistle:

Lol eBay . Yes I've seen that advert. £180 each isn't to bad really. Especially as they come with bumps stops and top mounts I take it ??

[mattCSLnut]

Lol eBay . Yes I've seen that advert. £180 each isn't to bad really. Especially as they come with bumps stops and top mounts I take it ??
Nope... just one rear damper (U don't even get the top nut with that) :banghead: ... it's BMW we're taking about here... everything is an extra :bigcry: including top mounts & bump stops.

[Rick H]

Pair, pick them up in the morning from Williams Stockport.

Rear pads too.

Rear SHOES too . . .

[mattCSLnut]

Rear SHOES too . . .

You're brave buying the OEM rear SHOES :whistle:

[Rick H]

You're brave buying the OEM rear SHOES :whistle:

Well I haven't bought them yet, I ordered pads 'cos I'm a dimwit sometimes.

Are they expensive ? ? ? ???

[mattCSLnut]

Well I haven't bought them yet, I ordered pads 'cos I'm a dimwit sometimes.

Are they expensive ? ? ? ???

Probably :banghead: didn't U ask at the point of ordering ? :whistle: however over inflated Main Stealer price isn't the biggest problem with the OEM pads. Anything over the regular traffic pace they will melt, fad and disappoint :bigcry: Seeing as you're Tracking your Cecil a bit I'd upgrade your rears to something a bit more rubust like Performance Friction 'Z' rated that I'm running in my OEM rears or PAGID RS series :beer:
Even EBC Red/Yello Stuff pads would be a vast improvement over OEM ;)

[Rick H]

Probably :banghead: didn't U ask at the point of ordering ? :whistle: however that's not the biggest problem with the OEM pads. Anything over the regular traffic pace they will melt, fad and disappoint :bigcry: Seeing as you're Tracking your Cecil a bit I'd upgrade your rears to something a bit more rubust like Performance Friction 'Z' rated that I'm running in my OEM rears or PAGID RS series :beer: Even EBC Red/Yello Stuff pads would be a vast improvement over OEM ;)

No . . . hang on, I have Alcons with RS29s on all corners. These are for the handbrake - MOT failure point.

I ordered pads by mistake, not shoes.

(in fact I hadn't - I just rang and I'd ordered shoes . . . it's going to be one of those days . . . :banghead:)

[mattCSLnut]

No . . . hang on, I have Alcons with RS29s on all corners. These are for the handbrake - MOT failure point.

I ordered pads by mistake, not shoes.

(in fact I hadn't - I just rang and I'd ordered shoes . . . it's going to be one of those days . . .)

Ahh OK ... that's cleared it now ;) OEM HAND BRAKE SHOES will be fine but you still might get shafted on their price @ Main Stealers.
ECP sell PAGID, TEXTAR and ATE (which I believe are the same as OEM) for a better price.

[Rick H]

Ahh OK ... that's cleared it now ;) OEM HAND BRAKE SHOES will be fine but you still might get shafted on their price @ Main Stealers.
ECP sell PAGID, TEXTAR and ATE (which I believe are the same as OEM) for a better price.

Can I go back to sleep now, my heads hurting?

Got Carfest North tickets this am :thumbs:

[Rick H]

Springs done, hardest bit was a bit of gentle persuasion on the damper bolts, then used an OEM e46 jack to release the spring so was all over and done in about an hour.

:thumbs:

New h/brake shoes on, bit fiddly but again no great problems either.