31k miler at Gray Paul Ferrari

[LHutchin]

Thought it would be about £45k but £52k!!!

Shame as it's just what I'm looking for :smt022

http://www.nottingham.ferraridealers.com/en_gb/otherbrands/2004/bmw/m3/2004-bmw-m3-nottingham-for-sale-sb04rke

[Trawler]

Well the dealer must think it is an interesting car, as I thought they just offloaded common of garden muck that they get as trade ins.

[LeinsCSL]

@Yanto - getting closer all the time: http://www.simonfurlonger.co.uk/docs2/cars/EFZEyuVuAFYhIQACKZ.shtml

[Trawler]

Thought it would be about £45k but £52k!!!

Shame as it's just what I'm looking for :smt022

http://www.nottingham.ferraridealers.com/en_gb/otherbrands/2004/bmw/m3/2004-bmw-m3-nottingham-for-sale-sb04rke

Looks like dealers are realising what good value they are. Best get in quick. Wonder what the black one on carandclassics sold for.

[Trawler]

@Yanto - getting closer all the time: http://www.simonfurlonger.co.uk/docs2/cars/EFZEyuVuAFYhIQACKZ.shtml

Just need a trilby & driving gloves to complete the picture.

[Neil M]

It doesn't quite fit the profile of their other cars for sale, there's obviously a big difference between a lowly Propeller and a Prancing Horse :hahaha:
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/bmw/e46-m3-00-06/m3-coupe-m3-csl-smg/4023315

[Trawler]

It doesn't quite fit the profile of their other cars for sale, there's obviously a big difference between a lowly Propeller and a Prancing Horse :hahaha:
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/bmw/e46-m3-00-06/m3-coupe-m3-csl-smg/4023315

Must be special. I see this car has 5 seats

[LHutchin]

Looks like dealers are realising what good value they are. Best get in quick. Wonder what the black one on carandclassics sold for.

Unfortunately it's out of my price range

I'm sure if I made them an offer they would look at me as though I'm something they've just trodden in :hahaha:

I thought the Hexagon car with 29k miles at £45k was expensive :(

Oh well might just get a 1M instead :hahaha:

[LeinsCSL]

Just need a trilby & driving gloves to complete the picture.

I already have a tartan rug for the back seats ;)

[nw99]

Nice car taking prices to a new level if it sells

[Trawler]

I already have a tartan rug for the back seats ;)

I can picture it now. :thumbs:

[Neil M]

I'm sure if I made them an offer they would look at me as though I'm something they've just trodden in :hahaha:

Nothing ventured nothing gained! :whistle:

My original point being that it doesn't feature on their cars for sale, so they may just want shut, you never know.

The last one sold with similar mileage was in March 14 asking price was then £39,995 :whistle:

[Mark CSL]

Unfortunately it's out of my price range

I'm sure if I made them an offer they would look at me as though I'm something they've just trodden in :hahaha:

I thought the Hexagon car with 29k miles at £45k was expensive :(

Oh well might just get a 1M instead :hahaha:

You better be quick the prices of the 1M are on the up after all i bought 1 :thumbs:
When i got my first CSL they were 2 years old for 30k then a year later i got another 2 year old car with 21000 miles for 20k
after 10 years owning CSLs look where they are now.

I think the 1M will head north as well.

[Yanto]

@Yanto - getting closer all the time: http://www.simonfurlonger.co.uk/docs2/cars/EFZEyuVuAFYhIQACKZ.shtml

Got the heads up on this from the owner mate......

http://www.thesupercarrooms.co.uk/car-details/mercedes-benz-clk63-black-series-hg57

#cantmakemindup :bigcry:

[LeinsCSL]

Got the heads up on this from the owner mate......

http://www.thesupercarrooms.co.uk/car-details/mercedes-benz-clk63-black-series-hg57

#cantmakemindup :bigcry:

Nice! I think there might be one of these in my future at some point. One of the very few cars that might possibly ease the pain of selling the CSL

[cslsuperfan]

Got the heads up on this from the owner mate......

http://www.thesupercarrooms.co.uk/car-details/mercedes-benz-clk63-black-series-hg57

#cantmakemindup :bigcry:


Yanto...this car is so you

Performance figures are tip top

Heavy old tub though.

PS

How's the new regime? still on the leccy cigs??

[Smokeybeer]

To add to the chaos, I drove this back from BHP in Aylesbury this afternoon.

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/bmw/e46-m3-00-06/bmw-m3-csl-exceptional-condition-ap-racing-brakes-2003/3942857

M88 CSL. Know the car has been known on the register, but never got to meet the owner, however grateful I am for passing it on to me.

Car seems fantastic, and despite what I might have got it for 18 months ago, I think it's a great buy in the market. Ignoring the fact that - what a car.

Never-going-to-sell.

Joseph AKA Smokey Beer

[Yanto]

To add to the chaos, I drove this back from BHP in Aylesbury this afternoon.

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/bmw/e46-m3-00-06/bmw-m3-csl-exceptional-condition-ap-racing-brakes-2003/3942857

M88 CSL. Know the car has been known on the register, but never got to meet the owner, however grateful I am for passing it on to me.

Car seems fantastic, and despite what I might have got it for 18 months ago, I think it's a great buy in the market. Ignoring the fact that - what a car.

Never-going-to-sell.

Joseph AKA Smokey Beer

Congratulations Joseph :thumbs:

Post this up on a new owners thread so it doesn't get lost.

[Yanto]

Yanto...this car is so you

Performance figures are tip top

Heavy old tub though.

PS

How's the new regime? still on the leccy cigs??

All good mate :thumbs:

[Trawler]

Got the heads up on this from the owner mate......

http://www.thesupercarrooms.co.uk/car-details/mercedes-benz-clk63-black-series-hg57

#cantmakemindup :bigcry:

Trouble is, drive it in Germany & every local is going to think you are a taxi driver.

[Smokeybeer]

Congratulations Joseph :thumbs:

Post this up on a new owners thread so it doesn't get lost.

Cheers mate. I have been restraining myself from posting so far until I had the keys in my pocket!

[LeinsCSL]

Congrats SmokeyBeer! :thumbs:


Trouble is, drive it in Germany & every local is going to think you are a taxi driver.

:hahaha::hahaha::hahaha:

[Matt21]

Tempted to get another and mothball it

Rang the dealer on this one. Service history all stacks up. Seems a good one

However, no subframe repair.

The newly list 39987 mile car for £45k also sounded good apart from running in service at 1700 miles

Finally the Millennium Heros 15k car has been withdrawn an no longer for sale. At £60k it seemed decent value

[pops]

To add to the chaos, I drove this back from BHP in Aylesbury this afternoon.

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/bmw/e46-m3-00-06/bmw-m3-csl-exceptional-condition-ap-racing-brakes-2003/3942857

M88 CSL. Know the car has been known on the register, but never got to meet the owner, however grateful I am for passing it on to me.

Car seems fantastic, and despite what I might have got it for 18 months ago, I think it's a great buy in the market. Ignoring the fact that - what a car.

Never-going-to-sell.

Joseph AKA Smokey Beer

Good news mate :thumbs:

From another newbie owner.

[AlexGTT]

Tempted to get another and mothball it

Rang the dealer on this one. Service history all stacks up. Seems a good one

However, no subframe repair.

The newly list 39987 mile car for £45k also sounded good apart from running in service at 1700 miles

Finally the Millennium Heros 15k car has been withdrawn an no longer for sale. At £60k it seemed decent value

Nowt wrong with run in service at 1700 miles. Only have to worry above 2000 ;-)

[JezP]

To add to the chaos, I drove this back from BHP in Aylesbury this afternoon.

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/bmw/e46-m3-00-06/bmw-m3-csl-exceptional-condition-ap-racing-brakes-2003/3942857

M88 CSL. Know the car has been known on the register, but never got to meet the owner, however grateful I am for passing it on to me.

Car seems fantastic, and despite what I might have got it for 18 months ago, I think it's a great buy in the market. Ignoring the fact that - what a car.

Never-going-to-sell.

Joseph AKA Smokey Beer

Well done Joseph you have a cracking CSL glad the ol' girl has gone to a good home. Now i'm remembering that Dunc thread of csl sellers walking the streets at weekends kicking empty drink cans thinking why why why :banghead:

Gimme a pm shout if you need any further assistance.

[Pethead]

Hi all, I'm a newbie and yet to become a CSL owner... What do folks think about the Graypaul Ferrari CSL - up at 52k which does seem excessive?

I enquired a bit about it, one of the prev owners had it on number plate HYP 1C and I believe was a Forum member ("Hypnotic" - based in Lancashire)... tired to PM him, but don't think he's been active on the forum since March 2013.

If anyone knows this car, or has some context they can share with me on it - please do PM me or shout to let me know !

cheers!

[nw99]

Will set new standards if it sells for that price .

[Pethead]

Yep, it seems v punchy - even though 31k miles is low.

Key for me is what members who might know the car think. From reading previous posts from Hypnotic, who I think owned the car from 2008-2013'ish, he had clutch, flywheel and ECU replaced under warranty in 2008 when it had done around 22k miles....

Is that a common problem, or an indication that its been mistreated? The fact that they were changed under warranty less than 10k miles ago possibly a good thing however...

Any and all thoughts on the history of this car would be VERY welcomed ! I think Hypnotic was a chap called Gary, car would have had around 3 owners before him, stock number plate is SB04 RKE

cheers guys:beer:

[LHutchin]

Will set new standards if it sells for that price .

It's sold :bigcry:

[mattCSLnut]

Yep, it seems v punchy - even though 31k miles is low.
Key for me is what members who might know the car think. From reading previous posts from Hypnotic, who I think owned the car from 2008-2013'ish, he had clutch, flywheel and ECU replaced under warranty in 2008 when it had done around 22k miles....

Is that a common problem, or an indication that its been mistreated? The fact that they were changed under warranty less than 10k miles ago possibly a good thing however...

Any and all thoughts on the history of this car would be VERY welcomed ! I think Hypnotic was a chap called Gary, car would have had around 3 owners before him, stock number plate is SB04 RKE

cheers guys:beer:

While I don't personally know that particular car it does sound a bit too early for a clutch replacement and points at a hard early life. While clutch / flywheel are a common issue they usually last a lot longer than 22K. Mine was changed @ 58K miles at the end of 2007. The ECU is not a common problem so it's a bit unusual to have been changes at all.
I doubt whoever bought it will be overly concern with it as all they'll probably see is a low mileage CSL investment potential.:whistle:
Best of luck to the new owner :beer:

[outnumbered]

Didn't loads of people have new clutches/flywheels and Murkett's a few years ago in the BM3W days when there was that big panic about clutch slur ?

[nw942]

When I enquired I was told:

"they also tell me the car has had a new top end of the engine due to slightly low compression on one of the cylinders whilst the car was in for a warranty check, so at present the car cannot be revved above 5,000 rpm for 1200 miles whilst running in."

[mattCSLnut]

When I enquired I was told:

"they also tell me the car has had a new top end of the engine due to slightly low compression on one of the cylinders whilst the car was in for a warranty check, so at present the car cannot be revved above 5,000 rpm for 1200 miles whilst running in."



If that is the case I'm just wondering when the bottom end will let go on this one as unfortunately that's the usual pattern of events with top end only rebuilds :bigcry:

[MCSL]

If that is the case I'm just wondering when the bottom end will let go on this one as unfortunately that's the usual pattern of events with top end only rebuilds :bigcry:


Just to put things correct -

This car HAS had a new bottom end (700 miles ago). Last year Gareth @ elms diagnosed the "common" head gasket failure upon compression test - which i requested when it went in for routine servicing. A new head was ordered. Upon strip down slight bore scoring was found. A new block and pistons, crank, shells, pump etc etc etc etc was also ordered and fitted (under BMW warranty). BMW warranty paid approx £15k for all engine work + loan car for approx 6 months whilst bits were on order from Germany.

A big thanks goes out to BMW elms Cambridge (Emma, Gareth and Dan).

The previous owner also had his fair share of warranty usage. New gearbox, diff, springs, (and more - which i can't recall at present)

The cars virtually brand new! Cheers BMW :beer:

[Bunty]

Thanks for the info.

As the car has had a new block, this car is now no longer a matching numbers car which will massively effect the collector value in future years.

That being the case, I don't think I would have paid £52,000 or anything close.

[Pethead]

Just to put things correct -

This car HAS had a new bottom end (700 miles ago). Last year Gareth @ elms diagnosed the "common" head gasket failure upon compression test - which i requested when it went in for routine servicing. A new head was ordered. Upon strip down slight bore scoring was found. A new block and pistons, crank, shells, pump etc etc etc etc was also ordered and fitted (under BMW warranty). BMW warranty paid approx £15k for all engine work + loan car for approx 6 months whilst bits were on order from Germany.

A big thanks goes out to BMW elms Cambridge (Emma, Gareth and Dan).

The previous owner also had his fair share of warranty usage. New gearbox, diff, springs, (and more - which i can't recall at present)

The cars virtually brand new! Cheers BMW :beer:
Good job for clarifying MCSL.

Presumably the engine number would be carried over - is that verified / confirmed by Elms ?

[Bunty]

Good job for clarifying MCSL.

Presumably the engine number would be carried over - is that verified / confirmed by Elms ?

I'm pretty sure when you install a new block that the engine number does not carry over.

[portlandgrey]

I'm pretty sure when you install a new block that the engine number does not carry over.


I can't see it'll make any difference as it will be fully documented by BMW.

[MCSL]

Good job for clarifying MCSL.

Presumably the engine number would be carried over - is that verified / confirmed by Elms ?


Yes.

[Bunty]

Yes.

Not correct.....It may be fully documented by BMW but the new block will NOT carry the same engine number.

This car will always carry the stigma of having a replacement engine fitted which will affect the future value as these are very much collector cars now.

[E46CSL]

Not correct.....It may be fully documented by BMW but the new block will NOT carry the same engine number.

This car will always carry the stigma of having a replacement engine fitted which will affect the future value as these are very much collector cars now.

It will not be a 911RS so does not matter. It would not have put me off buying the car.

[Matt21]

Despite buntys scepticism I don't think it matters. With the work carried out I think £52000 is a fair price. Won't be around for long

[Bunty]

It will not be a 911RS so does not matter. It would not have put me off buying the car.

That's personal preference, it may not have bothered you, but it would bother a lot of people that are going to shell out £50,000+ on a CSL.

The value for a collector is the low miles and originality, a replacement engine means the car is no longer original.

[Bunty]

Despite buntys scepticism I don't think it matters. With the work carried out I think £52000 is a fair price. Won't be around for long

Of course it matters.....someone may buy it not realising the significance of the replacement engine, but when it comes time to sell, questions will be asked. You have been warned.

The price needs to reflect that the car is no longer original.

[E46CSL]

That's personal preference, it may not have bothered you, but it would bother a lot of people that are going to shell out £50,000+ on a CSL.

The value for a collector is the low miles and originality, a replacement engine means the car is no longer original.

As you say, it is personal preference.

£50k is not a lot of money these days in this silly market on a scarce commodity, although a little toppy in my view - but the market decides.

Sum of the parts - I'd rather buy a M3 CS manual at 20k.

[Bunty]

As you say, it is personal preference.

£50k is not a lot of money these days in this silly market on a scarce commodity, although a little toppy in my view - but the market decides.

Sum of the parts - I'd rather buy a M3 CS manual at 20k.

50K may not be a lot of money to you, but it is to an awful lot of people.

These cars have doubled in value in the last two years, that growth is not sustainable long term. There is a lot of people talking up prices on this forum, which is fair enough for an owner, but anyone who thinks they are going to make a profit on this particular car come time to sell will most likely get caught with their pants down around their ankles after shelling out £52,000.

Trees do not grow to the sky

[MCSL]

Not correct.....It may be fully documented by BMW but the new block will NOT carry the same engine number.
.

:hahaha:

Here's an idea Bunty - put your mouse down, get off your seat, and go look at the engine number.

You wouldn't be the chap who's offer was politely refused would you? ;)

[Pethead]

50K may not be a lot of money to you, but it is to an awful lot of people.

These cars have doubled in value in the last two years, that growth is not sustainable long term. There is a lot of people talking up prices on this forum, which is fair enough for an owner, but anyone who thinks they are going to make a profit on this particular car come time to sell will most likely get caught with their pants down around their ankles after shelling out £52,000.

Trees do not grow to the sky
So this LHD 1973 3.0 CSL Batmobile advertised at £199.000 is significantly hampered in value because its re-spray and engine rebuild in 2011 lose its originality ....?

[Pethead]

So this LHD 1973 3.0 CSL Batmobile advertised at £199.000 is significantly hampered in value because its re-spray and engine rebuild in 2011 lose its originality ....?
Sorry - link below:

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/bmw/csl/bmw-3-0-csl-batmobile/2895963

[Bunty]

So this LHD 1973 3.0 CSL Batmobile advertised at £199.000 is significantly hampered in value because its re-spray and engine rebuild in 2011 lose its originality ....?

I suggest you put your money where you mouth is bud.

[Bunty]

:hahaha:

Here's an idea Bunty - put your mouse down, get off your seat, and go look at the engine number.

You wouldn't be the chap who's offer was politely refused would you? ;)

I don't need to check it MCSL as I know it's not the number that the original engine came with.

Do you really think I put an offer on that car :hahaha:

Did Elms actually tell you the car carried the same engine number, as you seem convinced.

[Pethead]

I suggest you put your money where you mouth is bud.
Easy there .... Not trying to offend - merely adding to the discussion and asking the question- do collectors look negatively at seriously collectable (and typically very old) cars that have had professional restorations - that can include complete engine rebuilds?

[MCSL]

Do you really think I put an offer on that car :hahaha:


:)

Apologies, it wasn't my intention to upset you Bunty. I'll tell you what dude - if it doesn't sell, and i can't give it away for toffee, I'll let you have it for a cuddle :beer:

[Bunty]

:)

Apologies, it wasn't my intention to upset you Bunty. I'll tell you what dude - if it doesn't sell, and i can't give it away for toffee, I'll let you have it for a cuddle :beer:

MCSL,despite what you might think, I am not having a personal go at you. I was not aware that you were selling the car. I thought that it was being sold by a dealer. From your post it appeared that you were a previous owner.

The remarks below are just my observations from buying classic cars for many years. If had known that a board member was selling the car I would not have said anything.

Good luck with the sale.

[Bunty]

Easy there .... Not trying to offend - merely adding to the discussion and asking the question- do collectors look negatively at seriously collectable (and typically very old) cars that have had professional restorations - that can include complete engine rebuilds?

No offence taken Pethead and I apologise for my short answer.

To answer your question, yes, collectors do look negatively on anything that is not original. Most professional restorers that rebuild engines will always try and reuse the original block to have a matching numbers car.

Good original cars will beat a restoration any day of the week, that's not to say that a nut and bolt resto is not worth a great deal of money on a collectible car. Just that an unrestored version will be worth more and significantly more in a lot of cases.

Non original rare cars are still very desirable but just don't command the same high prices.

As the saying goes " it's only original once"

:beer:

:beer:

[nw99]

Car is now sold ?

[Matt21]

Just passed Greypaul today. This CSL is listed as sold

[nw99]

Yes now up for sale at a Jaguar dealer

[E46CSL]

Yes now up for sale at a Jaguar dealer

Link?

[nw99]

There is no link it's not on the website . I called them

[nw99]

01625 546200 Is the Dealers number

[Matt21]

Doesn't make sense. Maybe someone bought and didn't like so chopped it?

[LHutchin]

Doesn't make sense. Maybe someone bought and didn't like so chopped it?

Probably noticed the crash repair work

[nw99]

Didn't say why he was selling it so soon

[Matt21]

Probably noticed the crash repair work

Was it in a smash?

[LHutchin]

Was it in a smash?

Well when I saw it, it been painted badly on the bonnet, wing, passenger door and into the B pillar shut
The wing and bonnet weren't aligned properly.

That would be more than stone chips imho

[cslsuperfan]

Well when I saw it, it been painted badly on the bonnet, wing, passenger door and into the B pillar shut
The wing and bonnet weren't aligned properly.

That would be more than stone chips imho


Good info and obviously one to avoid.

[LHutchin]

Good info and obviously one to avoid.

The fact it had an engine rebuild, and drive train replacements at so low mileage indicated it had been driven hard on track imho

[mattCSLnut]

Well when I saw it, it been painted badly on the bonnet, wing, passenger door and into the B pillar shut
The wing and bonnet weren't aligned properly.

That would be more than stone chips imho


Further proof that the low mileage means Jack S**t ;) I've seen a few low mileage horrors myself :whistle:

Good spot & THANX for sharing the info :beer: