Direct Injection Engines

[Trawler]

Do any of you guys have any knowledge of the coking problems with direct injection petrol engines? Appears R56 minis & RS Audis are bad. Was pi**ed off to read this after buying the wife a mini. Read horror stories of both makes needing a de-coke after 25k miles. Thought this problem had gone away when I was a kid.

Also wondering how this will affect value of expensive cars in the future e.g. The to be released GT3.

[shimmy]

Which mini is prone to coking?

[Trawler]

Which mini is prone to coking?

From what I can gather all the models with the updated R56 engine. Of course mini deny there is any problem.

The mrs loves her mini, which, is the main thing. Will have to ring Lohen (I think that is the name of mini specialist) to see what they have to say. Another thought must contact Roland as he drives minis.

[_Nathan_]

VW TFSI (GTI engine) and RS4 terrible for it too.

[Neil M]

From what I can gather all the models with the updated R56 engine. Of course mini deny there is any problem.

The mrs loves her mini, which, is the main thing. Will have to ring Lohen (I think that is the name of mini specialist) to see what they have to say. Another thought must contact Roland as he drives minis.

Give 'Monkey' a PM they (Munich Legends) do Mini's:thumbs:
Perhaps this is why the petrol formulation is changing to include super concentrated 'Fairy' as an engine cleaning additive. I thought de-cokes were old tech by the late 70/80's, 1 step forward 2 back!

[The Gorilla]

Hi,

Increased Carbon deposits are a by
product of direct injection petrol engines.

A really good thrashing when engine is
at temp helps burn the Carbon deposits
and some allege that more frequent oil
changes also assists.

The quest for ever lower Emissions is
Creating all sorts of these ''byproduct''
issues, which the EU and all the other
Green Lobbyists never consider.

The EU Plans for an even lower 95 Grams of
CO2 per km 2020 are already being robustly
challenged by Countries with Major Auto Manufacturers,
as they are more than aware of what those
sorts of numbers would mean in regard
of the Emissions from a Petrol engine.

Its currently 125 [g/km] and look at the issues
that your Mini and many other Direct injection
petrol engines suffer.

''Petrol Heads'' are just as much an endangered
speicies, as Primates !!!! GreenPeace take note.

Regards,

The Gorilla.

Edit- This idea was started by the ''UK'' and not the EU
as the UK wanted Credits for 60% Reduction
in Energy Savings and the 95 [g/km] was a
mjor factor in those negotiations.

[Trawler]

Give 'Monkey' a PM they (Munich Legends) do Mini's:thumbs:
Perhaps this is why the petrol formulation is changing to include super concentrated 'Fairy' as an engine cleaning additive. I thought de-cokes were old tech by the late 70/80's, 1 step forward 2 back!

As I understand it no fuel reaches the inlet valves, hence it does not matter what detergent is used in the fuel.

Another reason to stick with older cars if you ask me.

[Trawler]

Hi Gorilla,

So far touch wood the mrs mini is ok, 18 months old & 17000 miles. Driven quickly most days & just about to have its second oil change. Just hate how legislation is storing up problems for us motorists.

Does driving it hard really help & for how long. Over one 100 mile motorway trip according to the trip computer it averaged 28.2 miles to the gallon. So much for small engines being economical. Not much better than Cesil at similar speeds.

Hi,

Increased Carbon deposits are a by
product of direct injection petrol engines.

A really good thrashing when engine is
at temp helps burn the Carbon deposits
and some allege that more frequent oil
changes also assists.

The quest for ever lower Emissions is
Creating all sorts of these ''byproduct''
issues, which the EU and all the other
Green Lobbyists never consider.

The EU Plans for an even lower 95 Grams of
CO2 per km 2020 are already being robustly
challenged by Countries with Major Auto Manufacturers,
as they are more than aware of what those
sorts of numbers would mean in regard
of the Emissions from a Petrol engine.

Its currently 125 [g/km] and look at the issues
that your Mini and many other Direct injection
petrol engines suffer.

''Petrol Heads'' are just as much an endangered
speicies, as Primates !!!! GreenPeace take note.

Regards,

The Gorilla.

Edit- This idea was started by the ''UK'' and not the EU
as the UK wanted Credits for 60% Reduction
in Energy Savings and the 95 [g/km] was a
mjor factor in those negotiations.

[Mike R]

I'd like to think that if the manufacturers are aware of it, that they now have the relevant machines to decoke the engine and carry this out as part of a particular service, so that the customer isn't even aware of the issue. I wouldn't be worrying about it. Even if they haven't, a decoke is only £50-£60.

[The Gorilla]

Hi,

Trawler- On my Son's Mini the first
signs were slight hesitation to rev at idle
at approx 30,000 miles.

After it had a De-coke, it was fine again
but he sold it.

Its the Inlet Valves that Carbon up,
and some are now having the ''Walnut''
tratment, which by all accounts does
work.

MikeR- The Walnut Treatment is around
275-300.00 and the full De-coke on my
Son's Car was over 500.00.

So not sure where you get the 50-60.00
sum from.

And yes the Manufactures are well aware of
it but deny its any sort of issue.
Bit like BMW and the E46 rear subframe
mounts, problem, what problem, until
far to many complained.

Regards,

The Gorilla.

[Mike R]

It would seem that the big manufacturers have cottoned on to another way to con people into parting with their money. This was at a normal garage and not a stealership ;). Plus I know them, so may have been mates rates :).

[thegingerninja]

I have an RS4 B7 and a Mk5 Golf GTi Edition 30, both have TFSI engines and both have covered about 40,000 miles. I have had no issue with either car.

I did read about the issues with carbon build up on the inlet valves, but if you spend enough time on the internet reading about problems with cars, you would find something wrong with every car ever made. I thought sod it, just drive the damn things and worry about it if / when it happens.

I'm sure that if you took the head off my engines you would find a carbon build up, I might decide to have it de-coked at 50,000 miles, and if it costs £ 500 to do so, big deal. On the grand scale of things, it's not a major issue for me. You are worrying about something which may not effect your car during your ownership.

[Monkey]

I have an RS4 B7 and a Mk5 Golf GTi Edition 30, both have TFSI engines and both have covered about 40,000 miles. I have had no issue with either car.

I did read about the issues with carbon build up on the inlet valves, but if you spend enough time on the internet reading about problems with cars, you would find something wrong with every car ever made. I thought sod it, just drive the damn things and worry about it if / when it happens.

I'm sure that if you took the head off my engines you would find a carbon build up, I might decide to have it de-coked at 50,000 miles, and if it costs £ 500 to do so, big deal. On the grand scale of things, it's not a major issue for me. You are worrying about something which may not effect your car during your ownership.

This!!!

Its amazing how the few people that experience a fault shout an awful lot louder than the thousands who dont have a problem.

Could there be an issue with coking on direct injection engines? Yes. Can you do anything to prevent it? Not really.

When you consider the number of those cars on the road its a very small percentage that show a fault.

I will use as an example the diesel swirl flaps. If you read the internet you would think that every single diesel decided to eat its swirl flaps. However when you put it into context - ie the M47 was probably BMW's most popular engine at the time - its not much of an issue at all. Of course there COULD have been an issue with any number of cars, but there wasn't.

Keep driving your car as you would, if you dont do long journeys or drive it hard occasionally, get out and do that once a month. It may help.

[Roland]

This!!!

Its amazing how the few people that experience a fault shout an awful lot louder than the thousands who dont have a problem.

Could there be an issue with coking on direct injection engines? Yes. Can you do anything to prevent it? Not really.

When you consider the number of those cars on the road its a very small percentage that show a fault.

I will use as an example the diesel swirl flaps. If you read the internet you would think that every single diesel decided to eat its swirl flaps. However when you put it into context - ie the M47 was probably BMW's most popular engine at the time - its not much of an issue at all. Of course there COULD have been an issue with any number of cars, but there wasn't.

Keep driving your car as you would, if you dont do long journeys or drive it hard occasionally, get out and do that once a month. It may help.

+1 :thumbs:

[Trawler]

Thanks for all your replies. I was just wondering if this is a real problem with direct injection engines & will it be a problem at resale e.g. New GT3.

Adding to what Monkey says below we have to add the dreaded VANOS & that was something I never worried about after talking to a mechanic in Germany when having my old M3 serviced.


This!!!

Its amazing how the few people that experience a fault shout an awful lot louder than the thousands who dont have a problem.

Could there be an issue with coking on direct injection engines? Yes. Can you do anything to prevent it? Not really.

When you consider the number of those cars on the road its a very small percentage that show a fault.

I will use as an example the diesel swirl flaps. If you read the internet you would think that every single diesel decided to eat its swirl flaps. However when you put it into context - ie the M47 was probably BMW's most popular engine at the time - its not much of an issue at all. Of course there COULD have been an issue with any number of cars, but there wasn't.

Keep driving your car as you would, if you dont do long journeys or drive it hard occasionally, get out and do that once a month. It may help.

[Yanto]

I have an RS4 B7 and a Mk5 Golf GTi Edition 30, both have TFSI engines and both have covered about 40,000 miles. I have had no issue with either car.

I did read about the issues with carbon build up on the inlet valves, but if you spend enough time on the internet reading about problems with cars, you would find something wrong with every car ever made. I thought sod it, just drive the damn things and worry about it if / when it happens.

I'm sure that if you took the head off my engines you would find a carbon build up, I might decide to have it de-coked at 50,000 miles, and if it costs £ 500 to do so, big deal. On the grand scale of things, it's not a major issue for me. You are worrying about something which may not effect your car during your ownership.

:thumbs:

I LOVE this:

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/audi/rs4/audi-rs4-quattro-5dr-4-2-only-2-owner-full-audi-history/1459233

:smokin:

[thegingerninja]

They are brilliant all rounders!