Coilover Recommendation

[flipm3]

I am just about ready to finally step up and try out a "high end" damper and was looking to seek some advice from the good people of CSLRegister.

My E46 M3 is primarily a road car, but does see roughly 5 track weekends a year. In all honesty, I prefer a damper that will be comfortable on the terrible roads I frequently encounter, but still offer optimal performance at a lowered ride height.

I have gone through several "entry" level coilovers and their valving just really left something to be desired.

My current list of choices are the following in the priority order:

Ohlins R&T
Motion Control Suspension Single Adjustable
JRZ RS1
Intrax IK2
Nitron R1

I'm reaching out to you all to mostly hear your feedback on the comparison between Intrax and Nitron. Information and knowledge is rather limited out here in America and these two seem to be a popular choice in the UK and throughout Europe.

My car is driven all year round and I would prefer something that is a bit more resilient to snow/salt.

How often do these setups need rebuilds?
How are their street characteristics?
Any downside to running a true rear coilover with a reinforced rear shock tower?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!

[northernjim]

I have Intrax on my daily M3 cs :beer:


I do about the same as you 5 tracks a year, Intrax are fantastic on track, plenty of adjustability , and I just set them full soft for the terrible local road surfaces - Am thinking about using 18's for daily use to further soften the ride ( I don't drive fast on the road anymore - I don't see the point! )


http://i453.photobucket.com/albums/qq253/ilikethealps/photo-1448.jpg

I would say they are not the most robust against the winter salt ( my old kw v3were better in this respect) - And do need a little tlc to protect, and keep them in tip top condition all year round

[cantfind1]

I wouldn't go with Nitron or Intrax....too hard for what you are after and the intrax will not survive weather like snow and ice without yearly rebuilds....The nitron survive better but again I think they will be too firm for you plus the solid mounts at the rear tend to knock after a while...I use them....they are great bits of kit but mine is a purely track car....

I would go with something like KW or Bilstein.....do not put a proper coilover at the rear you don t need to....

If you want to spring for the ohlins then do so but again I think they will be too firm and also not stand up to the salt and snow....

My best bet would be KW, they are pretty bullet proof and stainless steel....

[The Gorilla]

Hi,

Dampers, one man's like is the
dislike of another.

For Road use and the odd Track day,
the std set up with better progressive
springs and adjustable camber plates is
a very effective set up.

Some say to hard for daily while some argue
to soft.

If you feel that Road / Track Adjustability is
must have, the Intrax 'HSA' with the
softer springs but the Track Valving is
a good option.

Car's sit on the springs and its the dampers and
Bars, when set up properly, that do the work.


Regards,

The Gorilla.

[flipm3]

Thanks for the replies and advice. I probably should have listed the coilovers I've tried in the past.

I have tried Stance GR+ (similar to HSD), KW V2, and KW V3 with KW Competition Valving. I found all three to only be somewhat acceptable considering that the valving really left something to be desired. Despite countless tweaks of ride height and rebound/bump adjustment, they were just not soaking up bumps on the road that I know a proper damper should.

I have ridden in cars with JRZs and Motons on the street and with appropriate spring rates, I realized that a real race damper can really be a dual killer setup. Coincidentally, I noticed a lot of the higher end race dampers offer solid entry level dampers (MCS S/A, JRZ RS1, Ohlins R&T, Intrax HSA or IK2, and Nitron R1).

I did think about spending considerably less and just getting brand new OE non-CSL dampers and Eibach springs, but in my experience, the OE dampers just lose it's valving performance rather quickly. Performs great early in its lifetime but really plummets in performance over time.

The number of days I spend on the track has simply decreased due to change in profession and allotted free time. After discussing with a lot of peers, they all recommend I go with the "best" damper that I simply can afford.

Considering the Intrax and Nitron setups aren't very common here in the States, I was rather curious to hear more feedback on how these coilovers perform as a dual nature setup.

Thanks again for all the help! Looking forward to hearing more! :)

[The Gorilla]

Hi,

Using proper''Race'' Dampers on the road
does 2 things, makes for shocking ride and
prematurely reduces their life span.

For any Damper to ''soak'' up bumps as
you describe and then be able to handle
1 + lateral G on Track without excessive
body roll ain't never going to happen.

Its your choice, good road handling characteristics
or compliant and predictable on Track.
If you discover anything that comes remotely
close to doing both, you will have discovered a first.

Regards,

The Gorilla.

[flipm3]

Hi,

Using proper''Race'' Dampers on the road
does 2 things, makes for shocking ride and
prematurely reduces their life span.

For any Damper to ''soak'' up bumps as
you describe and then be able to handle
1 + lateral G on Track without excessive
body roll ain't never going to happen.

Its your choice, good road handling characteristics
or compliant and predictable on Track.
If you discover anything that comes remotely
close to doing both, you will have discovered a first.

Regards,

The Gorilla.
Definitely agree on many accounts! I think this is where the JRZ RS1 and Motion Control Suspension Single Adjustable really shine. Granted I don't know their rebuild intervals, I am told not too often. They seem to handle a a wide range of spring rates, but for me, more importantly that have far superior valving to some of the KW/Bilstein options out there.

The Ohlins R&T on the other hand am told that is more so a superior street damper that is trackable. Looking at some of the spring rates they offer for the E46 and E90 M3, they do tend to be on the softer side of things.

But yeah, I definitely do see how to a certain extent street compliancy and track performance will be compromised in one way or another if I am search of a more dual setup. I guess I am just having a hard time finding the right balance for me.

I will continue to investigate into these Nitron and Intrax setups simply out of curiosity!

Again, I always appreciate the advice! :thumbs:

[Barry C]

I'm amazed you didn't like KW's. When set up right, they are all the suspension an average trackday goer is ever going to really need. I had them before.

The further you go toward race shocks on the spectrum, you're going to have something that's not as friendly on the road.

Personally, I've done the whole coilover set up before and now I'm pretty happy with the standard CSL suspension. I think it's perfect for road driving and a few trackdays a year

You've said the number of trackdays you do is decreasing due to free time. Why bother with super expensive shocks that need rebuilding and are harsh on the road?

[alexk]

In all seriousness, I think the ideal solution is to have the OEM suspension for the road and the coilover for the track.
I am personally amazed every time the same question arises.
"What is the best race-ready coilover that is comfortable on the road ?"
It's like asking "what is the best 11cm high-heel that is comfortable to go for jogging ?"
The examples might sound a world apart one from the other, but actually they have something in common. There is no answer for both, they don't exist !

If you want comfort on everyday driving, you need soft springs and low damping torque.
If you want performance on track, you need stiff springs and high damping torque, combined with sensitivity or low-latency if you prefer, in the response of the damper (so as you can cope with the bumps or surface imperfections on the track).

I am compiling the suspension for my car, but I know it won't be comfortable (who cares ?).

Finally, I think the Ohlins R&T is a good solution. It's supposed to be "comfortable".
However, I don't have an opinion about the Nitron / Intrax stuff.
I personally don't like these brands.

[Mike R]

I have the H&Rs on my car and because they were developed on the Nordschleife (where overly firm suspension is a handicap), they don't appear to be too hard on the road.

However, I have no experience of the OE damper and having only owned it a few weeks, have yet to do a track day.

[gingernuts]

Just bought some KW v3's so will be able to comment on them soon enough. Still trying to find some good info on data for an initial set up.

[phoenixcsl]

Just bought some KW v3's so will be able to comment on them soon enough. Still trying to find some good info on data for an initial set up.

There is a setup guide on the web which has been around 5-6 years when Thorney's were loving KW's, I used this to get some base settings on my old V3's about 5 years ago...

V3's are superb on the road, I don't think you will be disappointed, I loved mine, compromised slightly on track but as a overall package they are excellent.

http://www.corsaracecar.co.uk/pdfs/suspensionSetUp.pdf

[gingernuts]

Cheers for that! Also managed to get some docs from figas and Derek so plenty of reading before I put them on!

[phoenixcsl]

Cheers for that! Also managed to get some docs from figas and Derek so plenty of reading before I put them on!

No worries :thumbs:

I think you can still download the install instructions from the KW site if you need them, tho it's mega easy to do!

[gingernuts]

Should be able to install them no problems. Got a decent amount of experience working on road an race cars so should be ok. Will just take it for laser alignment and corner weighting when I've put them on.

[Brandtner]

Have been on V3s for 3 years (e36 M3 and E46 M3) - best coilover for road also not bad for light track work either. You won't go wrong.